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Euro-PIGS In Deep Trouble, And So Is The EU
Yes, but you still have to get an over bureaucratically complex set of laws...

It's only a rumor that EU rules and norms are overbureaucratic and excessively heavy. It isn't.

And the single currency, and a single set of norms and laws as complex as they can be is helping the economy by making trade and production much simplier.
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Greece is back in the news S2

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-12-10...rkets.html
Sodomia delenda est

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Yes, I'v read it. Nothing very important. Of course, politics is about different choices...

The article could at least say that Greece had a budget surplus prior debt repayment, first time in decades (if not in history) and ahead of schedule.

+ Greece rediscovered unexpected savings.
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PLease watch!!! S2
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[Image: 20150415_451241620150415135842.jpg]
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Nothing like a little bit of exhibitionism. S13

Too bad there is no skin involved. Incidentally, what became of all the Femen who migrated to Western Europe?
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Yes... why she wasn't topless with huge foul language written on her breast? Maybe it's running out of fashion...

TBS, Nobody has a the least idea why she did and what was her claim. Supposedly it was anti-Austerity. But it looks more like trying to get attention...
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Oh, and speaking of the PiGs, how much longer do we have before Greece officially defaults on its debt? I haven't been following it lately.
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They are kicking the can. The so-called anti-Austerity governement accepts to observe the agreements but the words and the names of the controlling bodies must be changed (at least in the press).

Someone half-greek half-german told me that greeks are hard woking poeple, but honnest...No!
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They are still talking as we speak...
But patience is wearing tight. Maybe it was time governments prepared for the plan B and the Greek governement would better come up with a more comprehensive list of reforms soon.

It seems that the EU/IMF/Merkel is not ready for compromise or freebies.

I'm not worried because the greeks have to agree, they have no other choice.
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What I have heard from others with more international experience is that in Greece and Italy, it is difficult to make a credit economy work, since people do not feel any great moral need to pay back their loans. Creditors have to charge something like 80% to 90% down, before they will extend credit. And this is for secured loans, purchasing things like cars or real estate. Forget unsecured loans, like credit cards. This makes it hard for capitalism to work. So they turn to socialism, which works even less. It seems like the Protestant Work Ethic is essential for Western Civilization, and nations that do not have it--even Catholic Christian nations--are doomed to fail economically.
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Yes it's true. Poeple from Greece, Italy and Spain don't have the same rigorous morale about repaying debts.
But I don't think it's linked to religion.
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..................And so is the EU.

No matter what happens to Greece, eurozone cannot survive, new study shows

Quote:The eurozone is doomed and cannot survive in its current form, regardless of what happens to Greece, a major new study shows.

New research demonstrates that members of the single European currency are becoming more economically divergent, making a single rate of interest increasingly unsuitable for the bloc.

Political, social and cultural differences will also make it increasingly hard for the euro members to share a currency. Eventually, the eurozone will have to either “integrate or disintegrate”, the analysis says.

The research, by economic consultants from the ECU Group, is part of Change, or Go, a wide-ranging study of Britain’s European Union membership and future prospects.

The study is being serialized in The Daily Telegraph at the start of a potentially decisive week for the EU and its currency, with Greece once again facing a potential exit from the eurozone.

However, the report concludes that whether or not Greece is forced out of the single currency, the eurozone will still face deep-seated problems that must be resolved by either a break-up or full-blown political integration. When the single currency was created in 1999, its advocates argued that common economic rules would help its members converge economically, making a single rate of interest more and more suitable to all.

However, analysis by the ECU Group for the Change, or Go report shows that the opposite has happened: the countries using the euro have diverged economically, experiencing shifts in supply and demand at different times and under different circumstances.

While many of the countries that joined the euro were indeed converging before 1999, the study suggests, they began to diverge afterwards. By some measures, the eurozone economies are now more divergent than at any time since 1982.

That, the report says, raises doubts about the viability of the eurozone in its current form. A single interest rate will be increasingly unsuitable for members, amplifying downturns in weaker members and over-stimulating demand in stronger economies.


Thanks to having read John Naisbett, including his "Global Paradox", I have known for well over a decade that the EU is doomed to failure. One of the many things he stated was that "The more We act globally, the more we think locally". And he was, and still is, right. I'm sorry Fred, but the EU cannot, and will not, sustain itself short of force. Its too bureaucratic, too large, too corrupt, too top heavy, and too centralized.

I just found this a few minutes ago, and lo and behold.....here is what the Academic entrepreneur has to say. And again, note his reference to "you know who". "Global Paradox" should be the global economic Bible for the 21st century. Trend-Line science really is a science.
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Of course there are differences between member states... especialy when you compare back to back the most extremes geographicaly and culturaly (like Finland and Portugal - LOL -)
The problem with this study is that nobody is talking about a single rate of interest !
No such a goal or need.

Also how did they conclude that economies were diverging? And how do they define "converging", to start with? These are very abstract notions.

It's always easy to invent things which don't exist and say "look, it doesn't work!".

But I think we have rather baffled euroskeptics in the UK: First by saving Greece from collapse and second, by showing unexpected strenght and unity over Ukraine. And now starting with migration policies in the Med and the TTIP talks.

You Wrote:I have known for well over a decade that the EU is doomed to failure.
Well and you will know it for over yet another decade or two... S5
Over a decade that you predict that the EU will fail and it's still tere... Don't you think it's time to reconsider your opinion?
Or do you plan to hold this belief until your death and pass it down to the next generations after you?

One thing you don't understand about the EU is that it doesn't force all countries to be the same. Instead it's a gathering of all our similarities. When we find something that we all have in common, then we decide that it's an european thing (rule, norm, habit, idea, whatever). When we find something radicaly different in some countries, we decide that it's a regional matter.
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Fred, you and I agree on almost everything..........except this. Sooner or later the EU is going to fall apart, or stagnate. Take your pick. And its not just because the Duckbutt is doing his best to make it happen.

Technology is going to make the difference here. Smaller size favors speed and efficiency. You can't argue that one. And as technology increases, the more efficient the entity, the more powerful it becomes. "The bigger the world economy, the more powerful its smaller players” – John Naisbitt
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