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Top Chinese general warns US over attack
#1
Top Chinese general warns US over attack

China is prepared to use nuclear weapons against the US if it is attacked by Washington during a confrontation over Taiwan, a Chinese general said on Thursday.

“If the Americans draw their missiles and position-guided ammunition on to the target zone on China's territory, I think we will have to respond with nuclear weapons,” said General Zhu Chenghu.


What I find so interesting is that China, like North Korea, beieves that warfare also includes outrageous language. Note that China, unlike the Japanese, are blustery, and seem to think that harsh language is meant to give pause to those who would resort to force when China acts in like manner.

So the question is: does anyone here honestly believe that China's actual policy is being telegraphed by this hawk? Do anyone think that China is capable of doing what she declares?
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All men are frauds. The only difference between them is that some admit it. I myself deny it.
H. L. Mencken
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#2
Personally i do believe that China would give a response in case of American agression but i dont think it would be nuclear response.

Maybe they just try to say that China is not Iraq and it would be very stupid to attack nuclear club member. That would make a risk of a nuclear war. And i do not think the population of our planet will think that China is guilty in it.

Perhaps this is the consequence of the meeting of Putin and Jintao in Astana and in Moscow. The problems of Chechnya and Taiwan a rather similar for both countries. And i think China has its rule to solve its own problems with separatists like Russia.
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#3
Nemerov, let's clear up something first before I respond to your gratuitous statement here. The verbal threat was addressed to intimidate the US into being cowed so as not to defend Taiwan, should China initiate agression.

Now, with that in mind are you stating that " in case of American agression" you think that helping Taiwan defend itself, this is American agression?
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All men are frauds. The only difference between them is that some admit it. I myself deny it.
H. L. Mencken
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#4
What I don't understand is Russia's attempt to ally itself with China in order to get aggressive on Chechnya. Russia seems to think the rest of the world gives a damn whether they invade again or not. Its not like Taiwan is sending terrorists to take over southern Chinese schools and killing their children. Putin's desire to draw a comparison between the two is damned stupid.

ATTENTION RUSSIA: Feel free to invade Chechnya again and get your asses kicked (again). We don't care. No one really likes or feels sorry for Chechnya anymore. They deserve whatever you can dish out as far as we're concerned.*



*unless they turn out to have oil - then Europe will get all pissed off S6
"Most people just want tomorrow to look pretty much like today." - Terry Pratchett
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#5
Well considering the "Bush Doctrine" of promoting democracy, I can't see how we can't *not* help Taiwan. But the official U.S. policy supports peaceful reunification. As I remember, Stratfor believes the bellicose talk on China's part is sheerly to sure up political support using nationalism, and they have no real intention to attack Taiwan.
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#6
Anonymous24 Wrote:Well considering the "Bush Doctrine" of promoting democracy, I can't see how we can't *not* help Taiwan. But the official U.S. policy supports peaceful reunification. As I remember, Stratfor believes the bellicose talk on China's part is sheerly to sure up political support using nationalism, and they have no real intention to attack Taiwan.

I'm not so sure if their intentions are to simply posture and then do nothing. However, up until the 2008 Olympics, I suspect that China will sit back and continue to build up its amphibuous capabilities.

The coming economic downturn with regards to China could actually cause the Chinese to do something out of the ordinary if they have a very restive population in 2008
___________________________________________________________________________________________________
All men are frauds. The only difference between them is that some admit it. I myself deny it.
H. L. Mencken
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#7
John L Wrote:Now, with that in mind are you stating that " in case of American agression" you think that helping Taiwan defend itself, this is American agression?

Ehmmm...
Guys, Taiwan and Chechnya are not independent states! They are not autononous districts! Taiwan is China! Chechnya is Russia!

John what does it mean "helping Taiwan to defend itself"?! Why should America help Taiwan? The rebell island is Chinese territory and China has its right to support own territorial integrity.

Maybe you send troops to Chechnya then? S1
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#8
I can't understand, had US recognized Taiwan as an independent state? :?
NO! If so, whom do you want to defend from China? Let's be consistent.
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#9
Some disjoint comments:

General: there is nothing really new in the Chinese statement; this was said a couple of times before ("Are the Americans willing to lose Los Angelos over Taiwan?" was said circa year 2000).

bh Wrote:I can't understand, had US recognized Taiwan as an independent state? :?
NO! If so, whom do you want to defend from China? Let's be consistent.

Quite unfortunatly, this is a good point that makes the US position difficult.

The easiest solution, incidentally, is to simply pass some nuclear technology to Taiwan and let them defend themselves.

Nemerov Wrote:The problems of Chechnya and Taiwan a rather similar for both countries.

Actually, no. Russia was willing to give the Chechens independence post the first war; but it turned out impossible: Chechens are expansionists and wanted more. But leaving Taiwan alone is no threat to China.

An analogy between Chechens and Pals is probably a better one.

Anon Wrote:Well considering the "Bush Doctrine" of promoting democracy, I can't see how we can't *not* help Taiwan. But the official U.S. policy supports peaceful reunification. As I remember, Stratfor believes the bellicose talk on China's part is sheerly to sure up political support using nationalism, and they have no real intention to attack Taiwan.

I'm not sure what the current Stratfor's POV is. The conventional POV *used to be* that Taiwan is safe until 2008. Bill Gertz' POV recently changed: he now thinks that an attack on Taiwan is possible *before* the Olympics.
Government is necessary because people left unchecked will do evil.

The government is composed of people left unchecked


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#10
I have seen a movie recently, where the US president and his team made a plan in 30 seconds - to give diplomatic acknowledge to Chechnya, then send troops from Turkey (over Armenia, as Armenians - strategic ally of Russia - would not resist in order to kick Rus ass), and that would be "the American bless to Chchen people". I was laughing and almost crying at the same time.

They like to say that Checnya is like a beautiful virgin trying to run away from dissolute bear's claws. This is all damn bullshit. They have never been there and they never saw what is happening there. They STILL think it to be a small island of people who fight for democracy... idiots. :?
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#11
American movies about Russia is separate subject, IMHO it's medical subject, for example (comments in Russian):
http://voffka.com/archives/2005/07/07/017938.html
Thanks God american participants of this forum are enough sober-minded, but a lot of americans were "educated" by similar movies.
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#12
The reason China won't screw with Taiwan until 2008 is "Dubyah" Bush.

I think everyone quietly understands that we won't let China do a slaughter on the people of Taiwan.
Best regards
Ken
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#13
John made a comment to me a while back and now I tend to agree. Russians are a particularly paranoid people.

While there might have existed some sense of sympathy for the Chechen people regarding independence 7 or 8 years ago here in the States, I think that is NO longer the case. What they did with that school and in that theater washed away any sentiment the West in general might have had for those people. Finally, the rumors of collusion between Chechen separatists and Al Qeada quashed any other desire to want to help those people.

If given its independence, Chechnya would likely not form a secular, democratic government. Therefore, the Bush Doctrine wouldn't apply. The point isn't to allow for independence anywhere and anytime. The point is to foster democracy and that's not something that would happen Chechnya.

As for Taiwan - totally separate issue. Frankly, I think the Taiwanese people would be fine being led from the mainland. Make no mistake though, the only reason the mainland wants it is because of the money being made on the island. That's a HUGE chunk of revenue the PRC feels like it is losing out on. And most Taiwanese support unification - just not while the PRC is so despotic. If the Chinese would be willing to put the hammer down on the DPRK and even force it to reunify with the South, then I would support the mainland absorbing Taiwan. Given certain assurances though. That it be done similarly to how the Hong Kong take-over occurred.
"Most people just want tomorrow to look pretty much like today." - Terry Pratchett
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#14
As I have stated so frequently here and at other places, the world is in the process of increasing the total number of nations. Countries that can no longer serve it's citizens effectively or efficiently are going to split into smaller units that will be able to do so.

And the very idea of China and Taiwan again becoming one are not practical. Taiwan has already done everything but officially declare independence. It is in practice seperate, and anyone who thinks that it is simply a province of the mainland is smoking something stronger than cigarettes.

I suspect the reason why our Russian friends refuse to admit this is because of their own vulnerability to further breakup. And I say again, if a country is too large to provide for it's citizens, it will eventually break into smaller units that will. If Russia, just like Indonesia and China don't do this, they will also break up.

Look for Indonesia to be first, and later for China to follow. This is why China is trying so hard to maintain it's hold on Taiwan. If it allows it to officially leave, then what is to stop other provinces from doing so.

My Russian friends here should think about this and then tell me if there are other reasons why they still think Taiwan is officially a part of China.
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All men are frauds. The only difference between them is that some admit it. I myself deny it.
H. L. Mencken
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#15
Quote:Countries that can no longer serve it's citizens effectively or efficiently are going to split into smaller units that will be able to do so.
John, small states are still states. That implies they would have armies. And with an army it is very lucrative to look across the border for some land that was stolen by your tricky neighbor in the previous process of break-up of a larger entity. Kuril Islands? North Caucasian steppe? California? Baja California? Alberta? Sheba Farms? Gibraltar?.... etc. etc. will be a small potatoes in such, essentially tribal, wars. So, if you are correct (that I have no way of knowing), more smaller states would mean more smaller (but very nasty, a la Chechnya), and very difficult to control wars.
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#16
Quote:Russians are a particularly paranoid people.
S2 S2 S2
I tend to agree..., but we aren't monopolists and champions in paranoia.
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#17
bh Wrote:
Quote:Russians are a particularly paranoid people.
S2 S2 S2
I tend to agree..., but we aren't monopolists and champions in paranoia.

I agree and disagree. No, you are not monopolists for sure. But you are definately the champions in societal paranoia for sure. S6

No one can begin to equal you guys.
___________________________________________________________________________________________________
All men are frauds. The only difference between them is that some admit it. I myself deny it.
H. L. Mencken
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#18
John, I see your point here... I used to smoke smth much stronger than marlboro while military service ( S1 ) but we are speaking about 2 bit different things:
You're telling that Taiwan has already done everything but officially declare independence.
This my the point. There is no such country called Taiwan. There is no UNO embassador of Taiwan. There are no embassies of Taiwan in the world and so on... In fact it is really like other state but there is no map where Taiwan is not yellow. And if i were china i would make everything not to loose this island.
And finally i am intersted in how will Bush motivate his attack on PRC? And futhermore what will G8 and the UNO think about that.
By the way, i am not a specialist in UNO, but dont Americans need permission of GA UNO to make such things? As i know, there was no permisson of UNO to intervent Iraq... S4

PS. While writing that i had another thought...
And what if that conflict would really happen and become rather serious and... will finally grow into... war? What would be the reaction of the world? Perhaps some countries (Russia for ex.) will... maybe.. tale part in that war to take there pieces of pie...
Oh yeah, know i see how paranoid we are S1
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#19
Nemerov Wrote:By the way, i am not a specialist in UNO, but dont Americans need permission of GA UNO to make such things? As i know, there was no permisson of UNO to intervent Iraq...

Wasn't it UN Resolution 1441 that authorized the use of force if Iraq refused to comply with it's agreements? I believe it was that particular one, if not correct.
___________________________________________________________________________________________________
All men are frauds. The only difference between them is that some admit it. I myself deny it.
H. L. Mencken
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#20
Quote: But you are definately the champions in societal paranoia for sure.
I thought we are so bright in figure skating only.
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