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Islam: The 'So Called' Religion of Peace And..............
#21
Why,if this big lie article is valid,did Muslims spread by the sword from Mecca to Spain and China if Mohammad was so da.mned peaceable?

This is the stinkingest hogwash in a while here. Why are Muslims so un peaceable today from 1 end of the globe to the other if this is accurate?
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#22
Moslem religion was spread to China and India by Mongols, they were late converts to Islam religion, and most of them were borderline Moslems. Mongols also attacked Moslem Persians, Arabs and Turks, they were not interested in spreading Islam, but wanted to scorch the earth.

Ottoman Turks also spread the religion, but they were interested in building Empire not spreading religion.
They started their Empire building before they become Moslems, and continued it after their conversion.
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#23
Kamil,

Yea,Islam just dispatched their own version of The Apostle Paul and 2 mates and Islam made it all the way across the globe,right? No fighting,no entering lands without an invite,right? Spain,North Africa,they asked Arabs to populate their nations didn't they?

The Sudanese blacks asked the Sudanese Arabs to occupy and rule them didn't they? Berbers welcomed the Arabs with love,right? Egyptians had no problem with Arabs populating Egypt did they?

Give us a break.
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#24
Ofcourse the condemned it. The Taliban condemned it. Iran condemned it. It was all double speak. Its called CYA, because they knew there would be hell to pay. The only one not to condem the attack was Saddam Hussein. Hussein praised the attack as a matter of fact.
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#25
And you consider secular Saddam to be a good Moslem?
He has seldom been inside a mosque, or seen praying. Most Moslems considered him to be a Marxist rather than a Moslem.
However, now Iraq is on it's way to have an Islamic Government.

Palladin, calling Genghiz Khan and Timurlane a Moslem is like calling Hitler a true Christian S2
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#26
Here's the money quote:
Quote:Warfare is always "disgusting", but sometimes you have to fight in order to avoid the kind of persecution that Mecca inflicted on the Muslims (2: 191; 2: 217) or to preserve decent values (4: 75; 22: 40).

I guess it all comes down to who defines decent doesn't it? Right now, those that define it for Islam define it as burkas and death to anyone not adhering to the most restrictive interpretation of Islamic law where women are put to death for being raped (cause you know they were asking for it) all they way down to manufactured outrage for every single perceived slight to Islam they can find so as to have excuses to kill more westerners.

Maybe it started out real nice but it's all about killing everyone they can now. In short, it's little more than a death cult.
I have seen the fnords.
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#27
Quote:Ofcourse part of letting them be is letting them convert the world. If people do not convert then use violence.

If anyone, even your own family suggests worshipping another God, kill
them. (Deuteronomy 13:6-10).

If you find out a city worships a different god, destroy the city and
kill all of it's inhabitants... even the animals. (Deuteronomy
13:12-15)

I'm paraphrasing of course.
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#28
Aretstikapha Wrote:Right now, those that define it for Islam define it as burkas and death to anyone not adhering to the most restrictive interpretation of Islamic law where women are put to death for being raped (cause you know they were asking for it) all they way down to manufactured outrage for every single perceived slight to Islam they can find so as to have excuses to kill more westerners.
Who "defines" for Islam? Are there leaders who have the authority to speak on behalf of the world Muslim community (if there is such a thing), similar to as the pope claims to speak for Christianity?

Quote:Maybe it started out real nice but it's all about killing everyone they can now. In short, it's little more than a death cult.
Who are "they"? Who wants to kill everyone they can, are you talking about 1.2 billion Muslims?
The US would be a mere pile of rubble and ashes if this was as you alledge.

What an absurd diatribe! :roll:
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.
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#29
Islam does not have an exclusive franchise on death cults.
I'm often wrong. But I'm not always wrong!
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#30
The Cheshire Cat Wrote:
Quote:Ofcourse part of letting them be is letting them convert the world. If people do not convert then use violence.

If anyone, even your own family suggests worshipping another God, kill
them. (Deuteronomy 13:6-10).

If you find out a city worships a different god, destroy the city and
kill all of it's inhabitants... even the animals. (Deuteronomy
13:12-15)

I'm paraphrasing of course.
I had to look up "Deuteronomy" here is what Wikipedia says about it
Deuteronomy
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Quote:Deuteronomy
Deuteronomy is the fifth book of the Hebrew Bible. It is part of Judaism's Torah - the first segment of the Tanakh. It later became part of Christianity's Old Testament. Its Hebrew name is Devarim דברים ("words"), which comes from the opening phrase "Eleh ha-devarim" ("These are the words..."). The term can also stretch to mean "discourses" or "talks", as is generally the case with the Greek word "logos".

Is that correct, did it became part of Christianity's Old Testament?
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#31
Quote:And you consider secular Saddam to be a good Moslem?

I consider him a man imitating a good muslim with secular intentions ofcourse. The definition of a good muslim, someone who puts forward a peaceful vision of islam to the west, stabs them in the back when they aren't looking and works towards the spread of islam either through violence or using violent muslims as their pawns. Such as the flying imams did now taking their case to the courts to establish a legal principle ending behavorial profiling and getting a prayer room in the plane.
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#32
Your comment is absurd.

The 'definition' of a good Muslim "stabs" whom in the back? :-k

Going to court is done by "violent Muslims", i.e. "flying Imans"? :-s

Try and make some sense, lad. #-o
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.
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#33
Try to sober up. Are you denying the imams are going to the courts? Some people are misinformed, uninformed, you're just blind.
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#34
Independents4Bush Wrote:Try to sober up. Are you denying the imams are going to the courts? Some people are misinformed, uninformed, you're just blind.
Read my comment again, and respond when you've calmed down/sobered up or whatever, dude. :lol:

My question again:
"Going to court is done by "violent Muslims", i.e. "flying Imans"?"

Look up your previous post for reference, and don't forget to engage your brain before hitting the keyboard. Wink1

Btw, your remarks aren't clever, more like a fat, greenish/blue turd fly that keeps coming back to lay its eggs on the pudding. :x
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.
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#35
Quote:I consider him a man imitating a good muslim with secular intentions ofcourse. The definition of a good muslim, someone who puts forward a peaceful vision of islam to the west, stabs them in the back when they aren't looking and works towards the spread of islam either through violence or using violent muslims as their pawns.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Package-deal_fallacy

I suggest you take a look at all of the logical fallacies.

Quote:Is that correct, did it became part of Christianity's Old Testament?

Yes, some good ones are in Leviticus as well. So whenever a debator points to Islam scripture as a citation that all muslims are '"disgusting"' simply tell them to read their own bible.
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#36
Unfortunately the followers of today's Islam, who preach this, are mostly Sufis, and Sufis are pretty much persecuted by the rest of Islam, Sunnis and Shaia combined.
___________________________________________________________________________________________________
"INSIDE EVERY PROGRESSIVE IS A TOTALITARIAN SCREAMING TO GET OUT" - David Horowitz

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#37
I think the point above is salient. Is it probable that a Moslem may use violence to have his way and feel justified via Islam?

I think it is more than probable. The Koran has two sided views,one peaceful and somewhat tolerant,one hateful and aggressive. It becomes more aggressive as it goes along. Abrogation is a doctrine which states that the last thing Mohammad said is best.

From there,use your head,read the news.

Islam also has a doctrine whereby an Imam may declare a fatwa(in English,a ruling) and it is binding on his Mosque. Aggressive Imam,parishioners who murder,nice Imam,parishioners who do not murder.

There are not many "moderate Moslems". In Oklahoma City,a Moselm stated publicly that Muslims in America should either be loyal to the USA above all or LEAVE and Islam needed modernizing. They kicked him out of his Mosque.

That's an American Mosque people.

Kamil,

The Deuteronomy information the Cat posted is part of the first 5 books of the Old Testament called the Pentateuch. The Moslem over at IAP who I used to argue with daily stated Moslems believe that is still the way to conduct business(during the debate over the Afghan Christian convert) and he accused me of claiming "God has changed" because I pointed out that the situation has changed,God need not have harsh rules over His people like this now that The Messiah has come forth and there are no theocracies now.

Islam borrowed from the OT many of these rules instituted strictly for the Jews in Israel while under theocratic rule of God,Mohammad's main mistake in doing so was he never understood (like the Pharisee Jews didn't) what the thrust of the OT was. It is about Messiah,that's what it is about from Genesis to Zechariah. No different than the New Testament,the difference is before and after His Incarnation. Both are entirely concerning His role in human&Divine history.
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#38
A few questions to consider regarding religion and peace:

A. 1. Regardless of how bloody Yahweh and Jeshua once were and they eventually will be, what does Jesus command his disciples to do?
2. Either literally or in principle, are the followers of Jesus required to do war or to do peace, at this time in human history?
B. 1. Regardless of what Muhamad did in his lifetime, does the Koran primarily teach Muslims to be violent, or peaceful?
2. Either in literal or basic obedience to the Koran, are the followers of Islam required to do war or peace at this time?
I'm often wrong. But I'm not always wrong!
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#39
Thai,

We aren't discussing religion and peace,we're discussing Islam and does it or does it not motivate murderous terrorism. We're not even discussing war between nations,that is too honorable for Islam to place them in the same paradigm as say Germany and Japan in 1944. Many soldiers of those 2 had honorable intent. No Moslem murdering or desiring to murder an innocent civilian has honorable intent,including those you desire to protect over the Jews in Palestine.

Neither has Stroll posited that Christians are motivated to murder non Christians,but if he or you want to,make the intellectual case and let's move ahead here.

Stroll has posited that Islam teaches brotherhood among mankind and that Islam's enemy is "disgusting".

I posit Islam is "disgusting" in and of itself and that it teaches hatred of everyone but Moslems. What were Mohammad's hateful rants against Jews and Christian for,to create love?

If you desire to make the case Stroll is correct,feel free to. The answer to your question A1) What is the subject and give us the answer so we may respond.

A2) Depends on whether or not your nation is at war. If America has no war,we are of course not to support war against an imaginary foe,if America is at war,we are responsible to take our place as unto The Lord.
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#40
Well, there's peace, and then there's peace. See: Peace, as Opposed to Peace.
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