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Right to choose?
#1
http://www.wfaa.com/sharedcontent/dws/wf...c5838.html

http://www.shortnews.com/shownews.cfm?id=60399&CFID=24648257&CFTOKEN=84815228

This is where the pro fetus murder crowd is headed. They talk about choice but it's nothing more than eugenics. Leftists always praise Europe and insist we should become like the miserable continent. Well this is what happens in the miserable continent. Girls have their babies murdered and it's against their will.

It went from a women's right to choose to others choosing for the women. Eventually the state will begin to force abortions when they their socialism gets expensive. The combination of secularism and socialism steals our liberty. This is what you have to do with your money and they decide what to do with your children.

Quote:We have to take a step back and ask ourselves how this could have happened to a 13-year-old girl.

I'll tell you how it happened father. Secular progressives convinced a bunch of zombies that killing your child is a right. The zombies became law makers and made bortion law.Then like I have stated in the past the left's position evolved into something more than they originally advocated. That is what progressive means, it goes from one extreme policy into an even more progressive policy. Once it was the right to choose what was done with her body and now it is the state's right to decide to take your body and kill your child.

Basically the left believes our lives is the SIMs. They get to decide what we produce, where we produce it, how much if it we produce. Who gets to have kids and how many of them. China under socialism has banned people from having more than one child. They decide where we can live and where we can not live. They decide where we cab drill for oil. Our life is a video game for the elitist left to manage.

Abortion, for the children.
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#2
Way to totally misread the story. If you'll notice, the state itself isn't ordering the girl to have an abortion, it's upholding the parents' rights to make that decision for their child. Whether you should believe the parents should have that power is another matter entirely. Don't mischaracterize everything you read simply because you want to demonize your opponent. Nothing fruitful will come of it.

Since you like to oversimplify things in a humorously overblown manner, I'll ask you this about this story: As a conservative, are you more opposed to abortion or parental power? Clearly if you have a problem with this ruling, then you have a problem with the rights of parents to guide their children's lives.

Why are you so anti-family, I4B?
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#3
Aristides Wrote:Way to totally misread the story. If you'll notice, the state itself isn't ordering the girl to have an abortion, it's upholding the parents' rights to make that decision for their child. Whether you should believe the parents should have that power is another matter entirely. Don't mischaracterize everything you read simply because you want to demonize your opponent. Nothing fruitful will come of it.

Since you like to oversimplify things in a humorously overblown manner, I'll ask you this about this story: As a conservative, are you more opposed to abortion or parental power? Clearly if you have a problem with this ruling, then you have a problem with the rights of parents to guide their children's lives.

Why are you so anti-family, I4B?
He isn't being anti-family. He's saying that the leftist crowd is being hypocritical. They claim to be for the mother's rights, that she has the right to choose. And now suddenly she doesn't have the right to choose, it's her parent's decision. And to be blunt, that means that all of the reasons behind why abortions should be legal are bullshit.
And he's saying that if the liberals have their way in the US, the same thing is going to happen.
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#4
Independents4Bush Wrote:Once it was the right to choose what was done with her body and now it is the state's right to decide to take your body and kill your child.

No, Saves, he is quite clearly accusing the state of forcing the child to have an abortion. This is only an indirect effect of the state deciding that it did not have the power to overrule the parents.
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#5
Aris the court made the decision. Whenever a court orders someone to do something they have the backing of the law. If they disobey they're looking at prison time. If this girl refuses to allow an abortion she can be compelled by force to get an abortion. She can be arrested. The court has upheld the desire of the grandparents to kill the grandchild.

Where are the rights of the girl and her body? Where is the right of this child to live? Yes the state has the right to overrule the parents. States have been overruling parents since the left began tinkering with life. It is only when the murder of a pre born child is involved that courts want to back the parents.
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#6
Ok, I just wanted you to be quite clear in stating that you're fine with the state overruling parental authority. I'm going to store it away in a little text file to whip out the next time anyone complains about the state violating family values or something.
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#7
Indy4, you're not being logical. Your opening post talks about women, but this mother is a 13 year old girl. Another post of yours then talks as if she hasn't had the abortion yet, but she did. Her country didn't force it; her parents forced it.

When and if you get to a higher university, they may finally teach you that A can cause B which in turn might cause C. However, sometimes A doesn't cause B, B doesn't cause C, and D and E have an effect on F and G in addition to H and I. Slippery slopes are not that easy.

The rights of the 13-year old girl are in the control of her FAMILY. Could you delay commenting on this until two of your daughters have had three teenage pregnancies? We were not ideal parents, but our girls knew not to abort, and knew that if we got to choose for them, we would choose for life. When my 16 year old was an hour from giving birth, I told my 13 year old grandchild not to make me a great-grandfather for a long time. Nine years later, he hasn't done it yet. However, his teenage uncle is about to become a father.....ahhh, kids..... S1
I'm often wrong. But I'm not always wrong!
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#8
Fit2BThaied Wrote:Indy4, you're not being logical. Your opening post talks about women, but this mother is a 13 year old girl. Another post of yours then talks as if she hasn't had the abortion yet, but she did. Her country didn't force it; her parents forced it.

When and if you get to a higher university, they may finally teach you that A can cause B which in turn might cause C. However, sometimes A doesn't cause B, B doesn't cause C, and D and E have an effect on F and G in addition to H and I. Slippery slopes are not that easy.

The rights of the 13-year old girl are in the control of her FAMILY. Could you delay commenting on this until two of your daughters have had three teenage pregnancies? We were not ideal parents, but our girls knew not to abort, and knew that if we got to choose for them, we would choose for life. When my 16 year old was an hour from giving birth, I told my 13 year old grandchild not to make me a great-grandfather for a long time. Nine years later, he hasn't done it yet. However, his teenage uncle is about to become a father.....ahhh, kids..... S1

I guess that's what you get for living in a liberal family.
Check Out My Site: Political Dishonesty
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#9
PoliticalDishonesty Wrote:
Fit2BThaied Wrote:Indy4, you're not being logical. Your opening post talks about women, but this mother is a 13 year old girl. Another post of yours then talks as if she hasn't had the abortion yet, but she did. Her country didn't force it; her parents forced it.

When and if you get to a higher university, they may finally teach you that A can cause B which in turn might cause C. However, sometimes A doesn't cause B, B doesn't cause C, and D and E have an effect on F and G in addition to H and I. Slippery slopes are not that easy.

The rights of the 13-year old girl are in the control of her FAMILY. Could you delay commenting on this until two of your daughters have had three teenage pregnancies? We were not ideal parents, but our girls knew not to abort, and knew that if we got to choose for them, we would choose for life. When my 16 year old was an hour from giving birth, I told my 13 year old grandchild not to make me a great-grandfather for a long time. Nine years later, he hasn't done it yet. However, his teenage uncle is about to become a father.....ahhh, kids..... S1

I guess that's what you get for living in a liberal family.
What liberal family? The first one got pregnant when she was still a good Baptist. The other one, when she had just become a screaming Pentecostal. Wrong assumption. The teenage uncle, maybe.
I'm often wrong. But I'm not always wrong!
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#10
Quote:Since you (Indy) like to oversimplify things in a humorously overblown manner...
Oh no, Indy has a few kangaroos loose in the top paddock and means his nutty stuff deadly serious. Italy is about as liberal as the USA is communist, they're all devout catholics. A 13 year old person can't decide about abortion in this country according to the law, the parents can. She went to court to challenge that and lost, according to the law. Besides, an abortion is not done to children, but a very small cluster of cells. Italian abortion laws, a lot harsher than the American ones. http://cyber.law.harvard.edu/population/...aly.abo.ht

And now... Indy-style coverage of filthy, corrupt American conservatives permitting a 13 year old American child to abort a fourteen week old fetus against the resistance of her guardians. Can an inmature 13 year old child mother decide about an abortion, and can an American judge decide in the name of the American people about unborn life? http://www.catholicworldnews.com/news/vi...cnum=36948 Remember who rules Florida? One member of the morally degenerated Bush clan, that regards abortions as a valuable instrument of family planning.
"You know, Paul, Reagan proved that deficits don't matter." Dick Cheney
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#11
Florida has a different governor now; the guy seems moderate enough. I'm eager to see what he does here.
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#12
The only one who is still taking this drivel from the usual suspects seriously, is Fit. My admiration for his patience - however, a wasted effort. :o
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.
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#13
stroll, I can take your posts with a grain of salt, since your avatar is winking Wink1. Indy, however, makes it difficult to tell when he's just kidding or winding me up. Surely a moderator wouldn't function as a troll! Perhaps he's just trying to keep the chatter going, increase the hits on this website....I don't know. Wink1
I'm often wrong. But I'm not always wrong!
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#14
Quote: Surely a moderator wouldn't function as a troll!
Least of all on a 'conservative' board which praises itself for furthering serious discourse amongst 'adults'.

Jane seems to follow the path of the bearpit, all non-US 'leftists' are reprimanded and/or on their last warning, and blatant trolling by some irrate, disturbed right-wingers is the rule.

I note that most of the serious 'conservatives', who at least knew how to argue their points, don't comment much, if at all.
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.
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#15
Quote:An Italian judge has ordered a 13-year-old girl from Torino to abort her unborn child because her parents were opposed to the baby, according to La Stampa newspaper

Now we do not know clearly if this is ture but it DOES indicate that the Judge ordered her to abid by her parents wishes,,,which amounts to ordering an abortion. This is what happens when governemnts start passing bad legislation.

Now let me pose another scenario, what if the poarents had wanted to STOP an abortion,,,would the leftists around here have been so avid to jump in on the side of the child or the parents?
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#16
I just want to make this point again. The parents may have made the parental decision for an abortion but the girl could have refused and the parents aren't going to tie her up and force her to have an abortion. The government through the courts has legally forced the girl to have an abortion.

Disobey your parents and you're on your own. Disobey the courts and you can be imprisoned. This is why I say government is forcing an abortion not merely enforcing a prior decision. Wink1

If you want to know when I'm serious and when I'm being facetious just look at who I am speaking to or about. If I am addressing a forum member I rarely get angry unless you insult me. If it is about people outside the forum like politicians, terrorists or criminals then yes I am genuinely angry.
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#17
Opmoderate Wrote:Now let me pose another scenario, what if the poarents had wanted to STOP an abortion,,,would the leftists around here have been so avid to jump in on the side of the child or the parents?
I don't think your scenario would have shown up on the radar of morally outraged liberal bashers to start with.

Btw, I haven't seen any "leftist" jumping to the side of the child and parents, but a couple of posters here have explained the 'intricacies' of the story, which the topic starter failed to comprehend.
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.
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