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Funding The Wall
#41
(01-21-2019, 02:44 AM)mv Wrote:
Quote:but are they completely extinct?

As party operatives -- pretty much so.
As voters -- surely exist, perhaps 30% of the population vote one party because it is the family tradition to vote that party!  One can find a plenty of conservative democrats among these ... but they would not revolt or alter their behavior.

Here is a more interesting question:

Do conservative republicans exist?

(among party operatives -- among the voters trivially yes).

I am not so sure ...

Me either.  I suspect the total number is less than twenty years ago.  I know I used to be one, and told them to 'Get Lost'  at that time.   Most 'so called' Conservatives are almost certainly Independents, just waiting for the Dumbasses to completely fall apart, so they can be "Whigged Out", and gain some Real Representation.
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Hillary Clinton Is Like Herpes, "She Wont Go Away" - Anna Paulina
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#42
20 years ago Goldwater Republicans were still alive and there were quite a lot of them,.. this is similar to orthodox conservative type.

Today : the ONLY conservative among Republicans I can think of is the Alabama judge (forgot the name already, I'm sure you know whom I mean) and you know how BOTH parties dealt with him.

So.... you want to be a conservative? Fine. Just don't assume it correlates well with being a republican.
Sodomia delenda est

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#43
(01-21-2019, 02:44 AM)mv Wrote: ...One can find a plenty of conservative democrats among these ... but they would not revolt or alter their behavior.
You know the old saying that you vote with your feet?

Back in the day when the KKK came out in force in the streets to support the Democrat convention, there were dozens and dozens of Klan who were ranking members of the Democrat House and Senate. Former Grand Kleegle Robert Byrd was the Democrat President pro tempore of the United States Senate. He filibustered against the 1964 Civil Rights Act. At about this time, The Klan had been virtually closed down by attacking their finances. (Remember the Mad Magazine poem: "Ring around the bigots, a pocket full of clowns. Four and twenty Klansmen, wearing hoods and gowns. When Congress started probing, the Klan began to sing. Now wasn't that a tasty dish for Martin Luthor King?") The landscape shifted and Democrats claimed they were no longer affiliated. To make it worse, they claimed all the racists moved to the GOP - which never happened.

The Dems have always been a moving target. Since JFK's day, the Keynesians have gained ascendancy and many Dems have walked out. Reagan's blue dog Democrats supported him against their old party.

People change and some stay the same as their party changes. The pressure to make things right stays.

(01-21-2019, 02:44 AM)mv Wrote: ...Do conservative republicans exist?
Sure they do, just like there are conservative Democrats. But in all things, a belief system of a person comes from the educational system and reinforcement from friends and the media. Since Alinsky, the propaganda has become formulaic and pervasive. It takes an effort to resist disinformation - and doing so is a person's highest calling.

(among party operatives -- among the voters trivially yes).
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#44
[quote pid='278156' dateline='1548105601']
Sure they do, just like there are conservative Democrats. But in all things, a belief system of a person comes from the educational system and 
[/quote]

May we have some examples, please?

OK, I would not be brutal... just one example.   And not David Duke. S6
Sodomia delenda est

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#45
JohnWho Wrote:Quote:
Trump Wrote:Finally, as part of an overall approach to border security, law enforcement professionals have requested $5.7 billion for a physical barrier. At the request of Democrats, it will be a steel barrier rather than a concrete wall. This barrier is absolutely critical to border security. It’s also what our professionals at the border want and need. This is just common sense.

It is no longer "Trump's wall", it is law enforcement professionals' and the Democrats' "wall".

However, Trump's mistake is using the words "Democrats" and "common sense" in the same paragraph.

LOL. I love how Trump twists the facts. Law enforcement professionals never requested $5.7 billion. Only Trump, as an individual physical person, did.
Professionals never ask for an amount of money by definition. A person asking for money is a politician and can't be called a professional in any field.

And professionals don't care about what should be done. They only do what the political leadership ask them to do. And sometimes they gave a feedback about what they need to achieve the government policy (more personnel, more barriers, more cameras, more vehicles etc) but they never say they need x amount of money.

Trump is asking this money while the project is changing completely. How a 30 feet tall concrete wall and a metallic barrier, hopefully not the same megalomaniac height, could cost exactly the same?
Trump is fixed by the number 5.7, or what?

WmL Wrote:The wall construction is a one-time thing. The original request was down from the Dem request

No. You really don;t want to acknowledge the truth. Trump's original estimate for His Wall was $23B.
Thought it may seem comparable to the $21B democrat project, the two numbers are not related.

Then the democrats took their own calculator and said that if Trump wanted to build a wall as he wanted it would cost, not $23B but $75B. I'm not joking.

Maybe they meant by that, that were Trump a democrat, the bill would jump from $23B to $75B.
Yet IMO, if you really want to build 30 feet high concrete wall covering the whole border distance, across the mountains and everything, it will cost even more than $75B.

You will notice that 5.7 is exactly 23/4 (rounded up). Hence my conclusion that he will ask theis money 4 years in a row.
I don't think Trump will content with only 25% of his Great Wall done.

mv Wrote:yet again, the amount of money is trivial comparing to the US budget.
Yes. Unfortunately, Trump has been unable to reduce or even stop budget and deficit increase, year after year.
And even a multibillion figure look tiny in regard to the total waste.

mv Wrote:he did twit many times that the only way to compete with China
Indeed. Whereas the China Great Wall can be seen from the ISS, Trump wants his MAGA Wall visible from Mars.

And that's why he asked Peggy Whitson, an astronaut on the ISS if she could go to Mars take a picture of it, preferably before the end of his first term (When the wall is freshly build, clean and not yet blown up by palestinos).

Trump definitely has an inferiority complex with the asians. Which explains his failed skin color change (dark salmon instead of yellow).

WmL Wrote:To make it worse, they claimed all the racists moved to the GOP - which never happened.
Well... Until Trump. But you are right: Trump is not a GOP member. Just used the GOP as a temporary base.
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#46
(01-24-2019, 07:42 PM)Fredledingue Wrote:
JohnWho Wrote:Quote:
Trump Wrote:Finally, as part of an overall approach to border security, law enforcement professionals have requested $5.7 billion for a physical barrier. At the request of Democrats, it will be a steel barrier rather than a concrete wall. This barrier is absolutely critical to border security. It’s also what our professionals at the border want and need. This is just common sense.

It is no longer "Trump's wall", it is law enforcement professionals' and the Democrats' "wall".

However, Trump's mistake is using the words "Democrats" and "common sense" in the same paragraph.

LOL. I love how Trump twists the facts. Law enforcement professionals never requested $5.7 billion. Only Trump, as an individual physical person, did.

Sorry, it is you ignoring facts in this case.  The law enforcement professionals, including border security folks, have indeed asked for a physical barrier.  While cost may not be their purview, requesting certain security measures certainly is, and they have. That is the point of Trumps statement - that the border needs to be secured and a physical barrier is an important part of that security.


Your dislike/hatred of Trump keeps you from either seeing or accepting reality.  


If it is any consolation to you, I'm sure if you moved to the US, Nancy Pelosi's family would adopt you since you fit in with them so well.

Oh, and LOL.


S1
I know you think you understand what you thought I said,
but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant!
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#47
Yes, Fred, indeed.

The Wall is a good thing! Whatever happens with it is not likely to get anyone killed, it is much better that Mr.Trump plays with things he knows rather than say invades Venezuela.

And if he decides to build a Pyramid next to best Cheops, let him.

OTOH, it is possible that he would be satisfied with a sandbox... this would be cheaper.
Sodomia delenda est

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#48
Government Shutdown - Second month without pay - :

Air traffic controller filled his car tank with his own blood to get to work. S11
(scroll to the middle of the article.)

David Cox Sr., president of the American Federation of Government Employees Wrote:officers are “struggling mightily” to keep the American public safe.

“But doing so while worrying about eviction, the ability to feed themselves and their families, to keep the heat on, to pay bus fare to get to work, puts this safety at risk

Don't these air controllers ever understand???? Trump's MAGA Wall is to make the US safer.

Requiring air controllers and custom officers to work at airports without pay, no matter how hard it is for them, because Trump wants $5.7B is the best way to increase the safety of the country.

In the meantime, there will be a free distribution of MAGA caps for the unpaid workers:
[Image: 5b3e340edda4c84a698b45a9.jpg]


JohnWho Wrote:border security folks, have indeed asked for a physical barrier.  While cost may not be their purview, requesting certain security measures certainly is, and they have. That is the point of Trumps statement - that the border needs to be secured and a physical barrier is an important part of that security.

Thats; what I said: The professionals working at the border never asked x billions, they asked for an improvement of the physical barrier among other things.

Whereas Trump, during his campain had promised a wall. A big, tall concrete wall.

And now this wall turned to be merely a fence elevation. Yet it still costs the same as giant concrete slabs. Proof he only cares about the money. Not the result.

I know it was not in Trump's statement explicitly.


mv Wrote:it is much better that Mr.Trump plays with things he knows rather than say invades Venezuela.
Yes. One good thing with Trump is that he didn't declare a war yet. He even brings some troops back home.
It's a rare thing for a POTUS.
This wall story keep the public busy. Even the Shutdown would be a good thing if it was useless workers who were unpaid and not the only ones still being paid. But nothing is perfect.

mv Wrote:And if he decides to build a Pyramid next to best Cheops, let him.
Yes: Why doesn't he want a pyramid instead of a wall?
A big pyramid in Las Vegas.

Because of Chinese? Let tell him, a chinese emperor had a tomb with 10 000 clay soldiers in it.... Watch for his reaction. LOL S2
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#49
It looks like Miss Nancy has again stepped all over her "Johnson" as Trump continues playing the Art of the Deal. Spiteful
If a budget deal isn't finalized by the time of the address, Trump will be able to scold Miss Nancy and Little Chucky, and then declare a national emergency in front of the nation. And all at the expense of the Jackasses. Stirthepot

BREAKING: IT’S A TRAP! And Pelosi Just Walked Right Into It!


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Hillary Clinton Is Like Herpes, "She Wont Go Away" - Anna Paulina
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#50
Actualy not: Trump retreats and ends Shutdown

What a disapointment, isn't it? S2
Declaring National Emergency would have been far more exiting! What and half-aas <--- S4

But it's just for three weeks. After that he will fight again. His obsession has no limit. The discussion will continue.

Too hillarious how they can turn this humiliation about the State of the Union speech into a trap for Pelosi. As the reporter said "some poeple don;t have sens of reality". So Trump is going to explain how the situation at the border is critical and requires urgent action LOL (illegal crossing is at 20 years low and the stories about caravans happens to be a myth). And he will declare Emergency. Realy? Emergency for a wall which will take years to build? They are dreaming...
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#51
It is rather obvious that Trump lost this round -- the alternative would have been an instant economic crisis or airplanes falling from the skies -- but it is not yet clear if he lost the wall dreams entirely, it may come back and Trump may again have a strong hand -- if he can use the pause to get the air-traffic control issue out of the picture.

As for what comes out of his mouth, or likewise from Nancy -- ignore.

These are all very smart and pretty people that America is proud of, with only minimal limitations ... cannot tell right from wrong, victory from a defeat, abortion from birth, male from female, or urine from beer.... maybe a few more like this....
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#52
The newest caravan has 12,000 people, combine that with what is waiting at the border and there are more than 20,000 individuasl ready to jump the border. Declaring a national emergency would be a waste because the Dems will go before the 9th Circuit Court to get a judgement to stop it. Trump should declare martial law, there is nothing the Democrats can do about it.
The true purpose of democracy is not to select the best leaders — a clearly debatable obligation — but to facilitate the prompt and peaceful removal of obviously bad ones. 
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#53
(01-26-2019, 09:01 PM)Canuknucklehead Wrote: The newest caravan has 12,000 people, combine that with what is waiting at the border and there are more than 20,000 individuasl ready to jump the border. Declaring a national emergency would be a waste because the Dems will go before the 9th Circuit Court to get a judgement to stop it. Trump should declare martial law, there is nothing the Democrats can do about it.

My guess is that he will declare a national emergency, and the Jackasses will get a judge to rule against him. Then Trump will rush things through to the Circuit Court and get a favorable ruling which will put an end to all this Bull-schist.
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Hillary Clinton Is Like Herpes, "She Wont Go Away" - Anna Paulina
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#54
Trump trying to save his ass is one part of it .. the base seems to be upset, judging by the posts yesterday.

Not the most interesting part, here is another angle :

Quote:The newest caravan has 12,000 people

Trump's Venezuelan project may lead to considerably large numbers of refugees.

Previous projects of this type resulted in total destruction of several countries, including Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan and Syria. Together they likely amount to half of the refugee flow into Europe. There are already refugees from Venezuela.... not millions, but unfortunately the US still has enough power and malice to make it millions. And I do not see them going to Europe.
Sodomia delenda est

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#55
Canucklehead Wrote:there are more than 20,000 individuasl ready to jump the border.

That's all? LOL. That's less than what tiny Belgium has to absorb every year. (In 2015 Belgium had over 50 000 migrants coming in). Belgium is something like 30x smaller, by population.
Overall there is an estimated ONE MILLION people waiting in North Africa to cross the sea to come to Europe.
So please, stop joking.

Canucklehead Wrote:martial law
Trump should definetelly try it.
That's one of the "must do" for a guy like Trump (second to sex with famous pornstars).

We won't be disappointed. S3


LOL: Taxpayers would have saved money by handing Trump his $5.7B immediately.
U.S. economy lost at least $6 billion to government shutdown

I'm sure Trump will make sure that it will cost much more to the economy than what he asks for his Banghead MAGA Wall.
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#56
Quote:US ECONOMY ADDS MORE THAN 300,000 JOBS DURING SHUTDOWN  

Tim Pearce | Energy Reporter
 464
The U.S. economy added 304,000 jobs while the unemployment rate rose slightly to 4 percent in the first month of 2019, according to Department of Labor (DOL) data released Friday.
January marks the 100th straight month of job growth in the U.S., a record more than twice as long as the previous one of 48 months set in June 1990. January’s numbers outpaced economists’ predictions of 170,000 jobs added, according to The Wall Street Journal. The unemployment rate ticked up but remains at a level widely considered to be full employment


It's a shame none of this will be reported by the mainstream media.
The true purpose of democracy is not to select the best leaders — a clearly debatable obligation — but to facilitate the prompt and peaceful removal of obviously bad ones. 
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#57
Quote:Mexican Government Busing 1700 Caravan Migrants to Unsecured Texas Border Area 

The Mexican president is a leftist, he has no intention of cooperating with Trump, the US should shut down the border the Mexico and let produce rot in trucks.
The true purpose of democracy is not to select the best leaders — a clearly debatable obligation — but to facilitate the prompt and peaceful removal of obviously bad ones. 
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#58
Shrinking ambitions:
Trump Wrote:I would be prepared to only build a wall in areas where the U.S. Border Patrol saw it necessary
Soon the MAGA Wall will be reduced to a few security camera kits and a four rotors drone.

reuters Wrote:In San Diego, high school teacher Stacy Salazar, whose students are primarily Hispanic and low-income, was appalled that Trump wanted to spend billions on walls when her school could not afford basic supplies.
high school teacher Wrote:People can find a way round the wall, it’s just a big waste of money
She doesn't understand: If Trump don't want latinos to cross the border, he also doesn't want to fund their schools. That's logical.

Instead of yelling "I will get it built" Gah, the smartest way is to, first of all, demand a list of priorities for securing the U.S.-Mexico border from illegal drugs and undocumented immigrants.

Briefing spokesman Wrote:What they said over again was technology. They don’t rule out barriers, they don’t rule out fences. But that isn’t the first priority.

“Technology” refers to devices such as huge scanners that can look inside trucks and cars, sensors, drones and other high-tech tools that could be quickly dispatched.

Senator Richard Shelby Wrote:The administration’s border security experts advised providing money for a mix of additional law enforcement agents, physical barriers and high-tech devices.

Got it?



Cannucklehaed Wrote:
Quote:The U.S. economy added 304,000 jobs
It's a shame none of this will be reported by the mainstream media.

It was reported if you read or listen the financial news. Which are boring to most people. People prefer bad news.

But I don't see any link with the present topic.

Nor do I for this (at random):
High-margin pickup trucks drive GM profit, shares rise
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#59
(02-06-2019, 06:15 PM)Fredledingue Wrote: ...Soon the MAGA Wall will be reduced to a few security camera kits and a four rotors drone.
Trump has always explained his border initiative as providing what the Border Patrol needs and has asked for. Before his election he had an interview with Sean Hannity, in which he explained all this, and also explained how "Mexico will pay for it." never meant they would cut a check.

Although high tech has always been on order, you can't physically stop illegal migrants from flooding across any open area to enter the country without a wall. Drones may put eyes on them,  but can't restrain them without using Hellfire missiles. Downward looking sonar and radar can find tunnels and electronic snifters can find drugs - but illegal crossings can only be stopped with walls to slow down the human waves to numbers that can be handled by personnel available. On top of that, Trump wants new policies that allow these illegals to be captured without letting them in, He also wants to stop chain migration and anchor babies. Let's see if Pelosi offers anything that makes sense.
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#60
(02-06-2019, 06:15 PM)Fredledingue Wrote:
Cannucklehaed Wrote:
Quote:The U.S. economy added 304,000 jobs
It's a shame none of this will be reported by the mainstream media.

It was reported if you read or listen the financial news. Which are boring to most people. People prefer bad news.


Unfortunately, your level of understanding of the media bias is about the same, sadly, as a large portion of the US citizens.  

Yes, it has been reported, but as you mention, in the "financial news".  However, if it had been, say, a 100,000 loss of jobs, it would be blazoned across the "political news" (read "page one") all over the media.

You wonder what this has to do with "the wall" topic?  Simple - it is an example of the corrupt media reporting which also includes anything regarding securing the southern US border.
I know you think you understand what you thought I said,
but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant!
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