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Nigel Farage, UKIP and EU Membership
Macron discloses the the shocking news, and in public no less. Shock

EU BOMBSHELL: Macron admits France would vote to LEAVE EU if country held referendum

But bureaucrats being bureaucrats, they just had to keep going. Had they stopped with the Treaty of Rome establishing the European Economic Community (EEC), known as the Common Market, they wouldn't have all this derision.
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"INSIDE EVERY PROGRESSIVE IS A TOTALITARIAN SCREAMING TO GET OUT" - David Horowitz

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It's not a bombshell. He's just honest about it.

IMO in France most of poeple want to stay in the EU (that's why they voted him and not the anti-EU Le Pen), more than in Britain, but in case of a referendum à la Brexit, the odds are high that a 51%+ votes to leave.
The reason is that those for leaving will all move to the ballots while those happy with the current situation and barely caring about a vote going on, would choose to stay at home.

On the other hand, a new referendum on the Brexit in the UK at this time would draw a victory for Stay. Now that they see what a mess it became.

This Brexit is realy a big mess, and not only for britons. France is going to hire 66 more custom servants to deal with the Brexit (lost the link). And it's just the beginning. It's going to cost us all.
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And here's another pro-Brexit party challenging the leadership,....in Finland.

Finland election brings NEW threat to EU: The Brexit-backing Farage fan vying for Finexit
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"INSIDE EVERY PROGRESSIVE IS A TOTALITARIAN SCREAMING TO GET OUT" - David Horowitz

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Yes the anti-EU pqrties use the migrant thematic endlessly. It's non-sens since only a united Europe can fight against immigration effectively. Same can be said about the russian threat. Ho, BTW, aren't all these anti-EU parties sponsored by Putin?
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(01-28-2018, 07:07 PM)Fredledingue Wrote: Yes the anti-EU pqrties use the migrant thematic endlessly. It's non-sens since only a united Europe can fight against immigration effectively. Same can be said about the russian threat. Ho, BTW, aren't all these anti-EU parties sponsored by Putin?

Somehow I thought the individual countries did a better job keeping out illegals BEFORE the EU. Am I wrong there?

As for Uncle Vladimir Vladimirovich, I have no idea about that one.
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"INSIDE EVERY PROGRESSIVE IS A TOTALITARIAN SCREAMING TO GET OUT" - David Horowitz

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JL Wrote:Somehow I thought the individual countries did a better job keeping out illegals BEFORE the EU. Am I wrong there?
You must be kidding. The bulk of muslim migration came before the EU, in the 60's, 70's and 80's. And it was legal immigration.

The current migration wave is different because it's illegal but politicaly tolerated to a certain extent, and lately less and less tolerated and because it's caused, IMO, by a much stronger demographic pressure than 40 years ago.

The EU did a bad job because the policy was to tolerate and let in a certain number of migrants. I think they planned a certain number but it was immediately surpassed.

My point is that we must change EU migration policies, not destroying the EU. The EU by giving a sens of mutual responsability and by sharing resources can be much more effective against wild immigration and human traffic. If they wanted.

They already forbid NGOs boats to cary rescued migrants to European soil. Now they have to bring them back to Lybia if they are close to Lybia or in Lybian's waters (which is almost everytime the case).
When they are rescued in international water, it's legaly grey territory. NGO boat can legaly bring them to Europe and being paid by the human traffickers for this service.
But the EU (or some attached body) started to forbid this practice a few months ago. I'm not sure about what they do when in international waters but close to Lybia. I think they still bring many of them to Italy or Grece, but in much smaller numbers.

Number of migrant crossing the sea have fallen by 2/3 since.
A sign that "the EU" can be effective when they want.

JL Wrote:As for Uncle Vladimir Vladimirovich, I have no idea about that one.


Russia is not a danger for Europe at this moment. But History tells you that who wants peace prepares for war.
If eastern countries remain under-defended, which they are, there is a real risk of Russia coming to fill the vacuum as they did in Ukraine.
They took part of Ukrain basicaly because there were very little defense there. In Crimea defense level was close to zero.

So, the need to increase defense in eastern Europe is real to avoid any risk of invasion form this side.

In both cases, the EU allows countries to understand these problematics even when they are far away geographicaly.

Finland can help stop migrants from Africa and Italy can help Finland against Russia. Each bringing its collaboration in its sphere of expertise or simply by participating financialy.
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It's been now one and half year that they repeat that. 
May to set out 'Road to Brexit' in speech  S18

- The referendum was hold on June 2016.
- The two years negociating period started 9 months later: end of march 2017.
- Which means UK is still a member of the EU until april 2019
- Now, they have decided of a transition period of two  years starting from april 2019, the day the UK formaly leaves the EU.
- Two more years, nearly nothing will happens since the all the agreements with the EU are maintained during this period.
- The transition period is extensible by half a year.
- This kicks the can until mid 2021.

===> After voting to leave, Britons will stay 5 years and countless Brexit speeches without Brexit. Gah

Yet, some poeple in UK think that the 2-years transition (the one that ends by 2021) won't be enough.
UK is facing the dilema between a fast but inadequate trade deal and permanent purgatory S24.
LOL.
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This may be hard to imagine but the British Conservative Party is almost as bad as the Dumbass Republicans over here. They say one thing, and then turn around and do the opposite. They're gutless cowards, who have little to no moral courage.

We really need a Nigel Farage here to keep hammering the establishment 24/7, because the 'insiders' don't give a Damn about the people who elect them. All they care about is their votes and influence at the top. Gah
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"INSIDE EVERY PROGRESSIVE IS A TOTALITARIAN SCREAMING TO GET OUT" - David Horowitz

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New Brexit stamps:
[Image: 27332569_10155996780368834_6143830048606...e=5B06CE26]
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NY Times Wrote:By March 29, 2019, if the current departure schedule is met, either with a formal agreement or with no agreement at all, Britain will no longer be in the European Union. But its transportation system will be.

I would not say that this is THE biggest Brexit non-sens because it will certainly be surpassed by something else even funnier. S6
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Last episode from the Brexit saga:

Businesses are relieved until 2020. Nothing bad will happen for trade, labor exchange and so on until then, and probably a few months after that neither.

Niggel Farrage and other Leave fanatics, much less so...

The pound surged on confirmation that Britain would remain effectively a non-voting EU member for 21 months until the end of 2020

Great, great, Brexit is giving the power back to the brits! LOL
They remain member of the EU, with all the obligations, but can't vote anymore, losing their rights.
Fantastic!

Reuters Wrote:The question will remain as to whether negotiations on the future trade partnership between Britain and the EU, which are expected to start only next month after EU leaders endorse Barnier’s negotiating guidelines on Friday,...

Huh... wait... wasn't these talks supposed to start by march 2016 or something? ...whatever ...

Reuters Wrote:... can produce results — and quickly enough to avoid having language in the withdrawal treaty that Britain, and May’s Belfast allies, cannot accept.
can produce results Oh my god! They expect results! Isn't it a little bit too ambitious?

The good thing is that until 2020, they won't need to negociate anything because everything will stay the same as before.

Quote:Longer term, the transition deal may buy people time but business still faces a “cliff edge” of uncertainty come 2021.

Yes but come 2021, they will start negociations again and make a deal to kick the can another 2 years to allow businesses to adapt or some non sens of this kind.

The biggest problem now seems to be the border between north south Ireland.
Because of the Brexit you either cut Ireland into two or the UK into two.
Choose the less worse solution.
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The Sunday Telegraph Wrote:at least a dozen of the 28 ministers in May’s cabinet were planning to block her proposal.
May in the Sunday Times Wrote:You can trust me to deliver.

S16

May in the Sunday Times Wrote:An alternative proposal, called “maximum facilitation”, which relies on future technology to ensure trade continues easily after Brexit, is also being considered
Blockchain?  S17

Reuters Wrote:The EU has dismissed both proposals

They are going to have a serious problem with Northern Ireland....

May Wrote:any deal (with the EU) would honour the agreements reached in the Northern Ireland peace process, which could be jeopardised by the return a border controls.

This means there can be no hard border between Northern Ireland and Ireland, or between Northern Ireland and the rest of the UK

LOL (link)
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