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OOPS!
#1
How's This For Efficiency? Azerbaijan released election results before voting had even started
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#2
Shhhh.... I think this country is supposed to be our ally, so no problem...
Government is necessary because people left unchecked will do evil.

The government is composed of people left unchecked


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#3
You know, I am at a loss as to the exact recent history of Azerbaijan, and its war with Armenia in 1994(?). Didn't his daddy take over in 1993, before the most recent war between the two countries? And didn't Armenia actually win its war over the Nagorno-Karabak region? And if so, what has kept the family from being overthrown?

I know why we would be rubbing shoulders with them, because they are friendly with Turkey(I think), and they border Iran. But is it really a good idea to support tyrants?
___________________________________________________________________________________________________
All men are frauds. The only difference between them is that some admit it. I myself deny it.
H. L. Mencken
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#4
His daddy, Geidar Aliev, was a big Communist boss...first the KGB chairman for the republic, then the boss (warlord) of the Nachichevan enclave, president since 1993. Incidentally, also a member of the Politburo of the entire Soviet Union... in alternative history scifi, where replacing Gorbachev at the right time is a popular topic, Aliev is one of two most common alternatives (seen as a man to preserve USSR with the iron fist suppression).
Geidar came to power after the main losses in the Karabakh war (indeed won by Armenia ... in fact because of the dissatisfaction over the results of war... and obviously now he is well entrenched.

As to why he is our friend: overall Russia favored Armenia, so naturally Azeris went the opposite way. To a degree... actually Putin managed to amass quite a lot of influence in both countries.

Quote:But is it really a good idea to support tyrants?


IMHO a secular dictator with socialist leanings is the best form of rule for many (all?) Islamic countries... Quaddafi, Mubarak, Saddam, Assad all better than the alternatives.

Heck, an impartial secular dictator in the US would be an improvement over Obama with his preference for Radical Islam and Sodomy!
Government is necessary because people left unchecked will do evil.

The government is composed of people left unchecked


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#5
Aren't they pretty much Tartars, of generally Turkish descent. Or something like that?
___________________________________________________________________________________________________
All men are frauds. The only difference between them is that some admit it. I myself deny it.
H. L. Mencken
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#6
They are pretty much Turks, asaik the language is nearly identical.
Government is necessary because people left unchecked will do evil.

The government is composed of people left unchecked


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#7
I agree with MV about "dictators". I don't like the term myself because they have their own ruling concensus as much as our elected guy has his.

I'm not sure our voting has that much effect anyway. Who cares if it's Obama or McCain, either way you get massive debt creation, you get the IRS tyranny, you get the NSA knowing every thought every human has expressed, you get growth of the state monster even with Reagan we got that, you have state hostility to privacy and individual rights, they all are agents of the state, etc.

Voting makes us think we have self rule, but, to an extent we just do as we're directed like Azeris and Burmese do and everyday we have less personal freedom than the day before. There's as much injustice in our nation's history as there has been in Brazil's for instance and they just got around to voting recently.
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#8
Aliev incidentally has been elected... and we do not know for a fact that he did not actually get 50% of the vote. (Recall the Singaporean president who has been honestly reelected for decades based on economic progress...this well may be the same type of effect.)
Government is necessary because people left unchecked will do evil.

The government is composed of people left unchecked


Reply
#9
(10-13-2013, 04:15 PM)mv Wrote: Aliev incidentally has been elected... and we do not know for a fact that he did not actually get 50% of the vote. (Recall the Singaporean president who has been honestly reelected for decades based on economic progress...this well may be the same type of effect.)

He is what I consider the perfect case of steering the herd around all of the obstacles, in order to get the citizenry to its best possible destination. It just shows that there is more than just the one way to get people to maximum long term economic wealth first, followed by personal freedoms later.
___________________________________________________________________________________________________
All men are frauds. The only difference between them is that some admit it. I myself deny it.
H. L. Mencken
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#10
(10-13-2013, 11:02 AM)John L Wrote: But is it really a good idea to support tyrants?

Seems only natural that our government would support tyrants, since our own government is ruled by a tyrant.

How was it exactly that Obama had the authority to order that implementation of Obamacare be deferred for businesses for one year? Congress did not vote that. The law does not provide for that. He just decreed it. And then he refuses to give a similar deferment for the rest of Americans.

It is Obama himself and no one else who shut down the federal government, by his refusal to negotiate with Congress, which has the Constitutional authority to decide what federal money shall be spent on. Congress did vote to fund the government, everything except provisions of Obamacare. So Congress did not shut down the government.

Congress ended the Vietnam War when it decided to defund the War, forcing the president to bring home the troops. Then, the president chose to abide by the Constitution. Obama seems to think he is above the Constitution. He is truly a dictator.
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#11
Hey, Ron, the boy is a Constitutional scholar here... I bet he raped the Constitution more times you thought possible... S6
Government is necessary because people left unchecked will do evil.

The government is composed of people left unchecked


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#12
(10-13-2013, 04:27 PM)John L Wrote:
(10-13-2013, 04:15 PM)mv Wrote: Aliev incidentally has been elected... and we do not know for a fact that he did not actually get 50% of the vote. (Recall the Singaporean president who has been honestly reelected for decades based on economic progress...this well may be the same type of effect.)

He is what I consider the perfect case of steering the herd around all of the obstacles, in order to get the citizenry to its best possible destination. It just shows that there is more than just the one way to get people to maximum long term economic wealth first, followed by personal freedoms later.

Yeah, something like this.

In fact it may be interesting to define the situations where voting is healthy for the society and when it is not. Quite obviously, when the %-age of takers closes on 50%, voting is suicidal.
Government is necessary because people left unchecked will do evil.

The government is composed of people left unchecked


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#13
(10-13-2013, 12:38 PM)John L Wrote: Aren't they pretty much Tartars, of generally Turkish descent. Or something like that?
Of all Turkics in the Central Asia and Russia, culturally and linguistically Azeris are closest to the Turkish Turks. However, unlike all the other Turkics, 85% of Azeris follow Shia sect of Islam. Turkey gets large amounts of Azeri oil and gas, and due to Armenia occupying parts of Karabagh, Turkey has closed it's borders with Armenia since the war. I don't know the reason, but Georgia has also joined this border closing (Perhaps, Erdogan being Georgian is the reason).
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