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Time to Hide Your Guns
#1
Quote:Obama Looking For Ways Around Congress On Gun Policy

WASHINGTON -- Faced with a Congress hostile to even slight restrictions of Second Amendment rights, the Obama administration is exploring potential changes to gun laws that can be secured strictly through executive action, administration officials say.

The Department of Justice held the first in what is expected to be a series of meetings on Tuesday afternoon with a group of stakeholders in the ongoing gun-policy debates. Before the meeting, officials said part of the discussion was expected to center around the White House's options for shaping policy on its own or through its adjoining agencies and departments -- on issues ranging from beefing up background checks to encouraging better data-sharing.

Administration officials said talk of executive orders or agency action are among a host of options that President Barack Obama and his advisers are considering. “The purpose of these discussions is to be a productive exchange of good ideas from folks across the spectrum,” one official said. “We think that’s a good place to start.”

Earlier in the day, House Democrats joined New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg to offer another possible starting point, announcing legislation that would make fundamental changes to the nation’s gun background check system. Sponsored by Rep. Carolyn McCarthy (D-N.Y.), a longtime gun control advocate, the bill mirrors one introduced late last month by another New York Democrat, Sen. Chuck Schumer.

“Too often, any serious discussion about guns devolves into ideological arguments that have nothing to do with the real problem,” Bloomberg, a co-founder of the coalition Mayors Against Illegal Guns, told reporters at a press event outside the Capitol. “Our coalition strongly believes in the Second Amendment. We also know from experience that we can keep guns away from dangerous people without imposing burdens on law-abiding gun owners."

For gun control advocates, however, executive action remains a more promising -- albeit more limited -- vehicle for reform than Congress. On Monday, The Huffington Post first reported that the Justice Department was convening meetings with groups from across the ideological spectrum in an effort to chart potential policy changes to Second Amendment law.

The discussions were meant to build a broad coalition around the elements of reform Obama had outlined a day earlier in an op-ed for the Arizona Daily Star, including stronger state-to-state coordination, expedited background checks and greater enforcement of the laws already on the books, especially with regard to the National Instant Criminal Background Check System.

WASHINGTON -- Faced with a Congress hostile to even slight restrictions of Second Amendment rights, the Obama administration is exploring potential changes to gun laws that can be secured strictly through executive action, administration officials say.

The Department of Justice held the first in what is expected to be a series of meetings on Tuesday afternoon with a group of stakeholders in the ongoing gun-policy debates. Before the meeting, officials said part of the discussion was expected to center around the White House's options for shaping policy on its own or through its adjoining agencies and departments -- on issues ranging from beefing up background checks to encouraging better data-sharing.

Administration officials said talk of executive orders or agency action are among a host of options that President Barack Obama and his advisers are considering. “The purpose of these discussions is to be a productive exchange of good ideas from folks across the spectrum,” one official said. “We think that’s a good place to start.”

Earlier in the day, House Democrats joined New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg to offer another possible starting point, announcing legislation that would make fundamental changes to the nation’s gun background check system. Sponsored by Rep. Carolyn McCarthy (D-N.Y.), a longtime gun control advocate, the bill mirrors one introduced late last month by another New York Democrat, Sen. Chuck Schumer.

“Too often, any serious discussion about guns devolves into ideological arguments that have nothing to do with the real problem,” Bloomberg, a co-founder of the coalition Mayors Against Illegal Guns, told reporters at a press event outside the Capitol. “Our coalition strongly believes in the Second Amendment. We also know from experience that we can keep guns away from dangerous people without imposing burdens on law-abiding gun owners."

For gun control advocates, however, executive action remains a more promising -- albeit more limited -- vehicle for reform than Congress. On Monday, The Huffington Post first reported that the Justice Department was convening meetings with groups from across the ideological spectrum in an effort to chart potential policy changes to Second Amendment law.

The discussions were meant to build a broad coalition around the elements of reform Obama had outlined a day earlier in an op-ed for the Arizona Daily Star, including stronger state-to-state coordination, expedited background checks and greater enforcement of the laws already on the books, especially with regard to the National Instant Criminal Background Check System.
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But the coalition-building didn’t start off on a promising note. The National Rifle Association responded to the op-ed by arguing that Obama had missed the point “entirely” in ignoring lax law enforcement and shortcomings in the nation's mental health system.

The NRA’s response crystallized what administration officials and gun control advocates have long known to be a major potential roadblock in any reform effort: a policy approach that gives off even the hint of restricting access to firearms will be met with forceful opposition by the gun lobby and its allies.

Even when Democrats attempted to limit the ability of outside interest groups to make anonymous campaign donations, they ultimately exempted the NRA for fear that the group would derail the entire enterprise. And so, the conversation has drifted towards executive action.

“We need tougher laws, but there’s a lot we can and should be doing to enforce the laws we have,” said Mark Glaze, the executive director of Mayors Against Illegal Guns. “Sometimes it’s a question of manpower and money, but in many cases it’s just a question of political will. We think the president knows that and is getting there.”

The extent to which Obama can change gun law without the hand of Congress is not, gun control activists say, wholly insignificant. Though they say they'd prefer longer-lasting, broader legislative responses to shootings like that which occurred in Tucson, Ariz., in early January, there are notable gaps that can be filled with presidential action.

With respect to the shooting of Rep. Gabrielle Giffords (D-Ariz.), a Clinton-era rule had prevented the military from reporting to the Federal Bureau of Investigation that the alleged shooter, Jared Loughner, had been rejected as a recruit for failing a drug test. Obama could reverse that without Congress, Glaze and an administration official said.

As for other possible actions that can be taken without Congress, Mayors Against Illegal Guns has compiled a wishlist of sorts, suggesting that the national background-check system enforce the requirement that all federal agencies report individuals forbidden under federal law from purchasing guns; that the White House restructure regulations requiring that the FBI destroy firearm-purchase records after 90 days; that the FBI, DOJ and the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives be more aggressive in pursuing federal prosecutions against those individuals who illegally attempted to buy firearms; and that the latter agency ramp up undercover investigations of sales at gun shows.


What's the difference between a dictator and someone who rules by executive order?
The true purpose of democracy is not to select the best leaders — a clearly debatable obligation — but to facilitate the prompt and peaceful removal of obviously bad ones. 
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#2
Executive Order is the only thing he has available to use from now on, unless he is able to get the Jackasses back in control of both houses of congress. In 2012 the Jackasses are going to lose what tiny majority they have too, so he is going to be totally isolated if he is reelected.

That is why he is doing what he is doing. But he is not a dictator. Just a 'want-to-be' dictator. Its something Leftists dream of being, since it is very difficult to get enough voters to support the loss of their liberties, and vote for it to happen.
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"Falsehood flies, and truth comes limping after it" - Jonathan Swift, 1710
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#3
Actually, John, Obama has taken a lesson from Clinton to use Executive Orders to rule. No need even for a budget.

any administration can make proclamations and binding regulations which are the equivalent of law, which will pass into "settled law" unless repudiated by Congress - a 2/3 majority if often required to override an Executive Order.

"Stroke of the pen. Law of the Land. Kinda cool."
Paul Begala, former Clinton advisor, The New York Times, July 5, 1998

"We've switched the rules of the game. We're not trying to do anything legislatively."
Interior Secretary Bruce Babbitt, The Washington Times, June 14, 1999

Executive Orders (EOs) are legally binding orders given by the President, acting as the head of the Executive Branch, to Federal Administrative Agencies. Executive Orders are generally used to direct federal agencies and officials in their execution of congressionally established laws or policies. However, in many instances they have been used to guide agencies in directions contrary to congressional intent.

Unless held in check, the President can do almost anything. In the past, it has been the personal honor of the President that has prevented dictatorial powers. Obama has none.
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#4
Quote:Obama At University Of Chicago: “I Don’t Believe People Should Be Able To Own Guns”…

...The chapter documents the actions that Obama has taken on guns, citing the following:

In 1996, Obama supported a ban on handguns
In 1998, he supported a ban on the sale of all semi-automatic guns
In 2004, he advocated banning gun sales within five miles of a school or park, which would have shut down nearly all gun stores
Mr. Lott concludes the chapter, titled, "Bewitched, Bothered, and Bewildered," writing, "Barack Obama is the most anti-gun president ever. That claim is based not on my own interactions with him back in the 1990's but on his own public record over many years."

He ends with a warning:

"The greatest threat is in his [Obama's] power to reshape the federal courts...Each appointment to the Supreme Court could determine whether the people are allowed to keep their guns."

Frightening isn't it?
The true purpose of democracy is not to select the best leaders — a clearly debatable obligation — but to facilitate the prompt and peaceful removal of obviously bad ones. 
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#5
In my opinion, I see nothing wrong with making sure the "laws on the books right now" are strictly upheld--even if nothing is done about the present clip quantity or actual guns on the market. [Image: shrug.gif]
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#6
I heard about that earlier. Ain't he just neat? I wonder why all this never came out before? Personally, I see two main culprits here. First is the Whore Media, who are whores for the Jackass. And Secondly I see the 'so called' opposition from the DOP. Where were they with all this knowledge in 2008, much less 2012?

I say a Pox on Both of their houses.
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"Falsehood flies, and truth comes limping after it" - Jonathan Swift, 1710
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#7
(03-06-2013, 05:21 PM)Grizzly Wrote: In my opinion, I see nothing wrong with making sure the "laws on the books right now" are strictly upheld--even if nothing is done about the present clip quantity or actual guns on the market. [Image: shrug.gif]

Well, that's all wonderful Robert. However, you did not address the main point there. Is this just an inability to read, and process information correctly? Or is it a desire to sugar coat your Team without coming out and having to actually find fault with your Alpha Male?
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"Falsehood flies, and truth comes limping after it" - Jonathan Swift, 1710
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#8
I think Obama is going to fail on gun control myself. He's barking up the wrong tree.

Now, handouts and something for nothing, he'll do well with ideas like these. He has a large audience supporting that idea.
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#9
What if he loads the Supreme Court will more hardcore Leftists.
The true purpose of democracy is not to select the best leaders — a clearly debatable obligation — but to facilitate the prompt and peaceful removal of obviously bad ones. 
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#10
(03-06-2013, 05:24 PM)John L Wrote:
(03-06-2013, 05:21 PM)Grizzly Wrote: In my opinion, I see nothing wrong with making sure the "laws on the books right now" are strictly upheld--even if nothing is done about the present clip quantity or actual guns on the market. [Image: shrug.gif]

Well, that's all wonderful Robert. However, you did not address the main point there. Is this just an inability to read, and process information correctly? Or is it a desire to sugar coat your Team without coming out and having to actually find fault with your Alpha Male?
The main point is Obama is only enforcing the laws on the books now. What's your point?
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#11
Robert, do you know the difference between a "clip" and a "Magazine"? Do you? And if you did, would you actually try to be accurate in your descriptions? And if you are unwilling to do that, should others pay attention to you when you keep making the incorrect descriptions of such easy things, and then expect us to pay attention to the more complicated?

Here is something that may possibly help.

[Image: clip_magazine.jpg?__SQUARESPACE_CACHEVER...9244330073]
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"Falsehood flies, and truth comes limping after it" - Jonathan Swift, 1710
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#12
Why did only come to light now, where was the press in 2008?
The true purpose of democracy is not to select the best leaders — a clearly debatable obligation — but to facilitate the prompt and peaceful removal of obviously bad ones. 
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#13
I have no idea, other than the fact that the Whore Media is, well, a bunch of whores and not interested in learning anything of the truth.

Robert won't make any real attempt at answering that question, because he too really doesn't want to be informed. Hell, he's not informed enough to know the difference between a magazine and a clip, why should he want to know something more complicated? I've asked him and he comes out with the stock answer about enforcement of existing laws. But Obama can always make executive directives, tomorrow or the next day. Will he be supporting those as well. And what if they are unconstitutional too?

I really want to know his stance on this, but cannot get a straight answer. And that is the same reason why nobody has bothered rooting around for the facts. They really aren't interested because it would make their team look bad. Its all about the team getting a 'leg up' and to hell with decency or integrity. I cannot think of anything else,......honest.
___________________________________________________________________________________________________
"Falsehood flies, and truth comes limping after it" - Jonathan Swift, 1710
Reply
#14
(03-06-2013, 05:21 PM)Grizzly Wrote: In my opinion, I see nothing wrong with making sure the "laws on the books right now" are strictly upheld--even if nothing is done about the present clip quantity or actual guns on the market. [Image: shrug.gif]

Those unamed laws you write about are not effective with criminals and crazy people.
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#15
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BVz2lHODQvs

When the Democrats gain the majority on the Supreme Court, it will be no holds barred assault on the Second Amendment from the Left, and there will not be a thing you can do about it because they will have all the steps in place to move quickly to seize all weapons.
The true purpose of democracy is not to select the best leaders — a clearly debatable obligation — but to facilitate the prompt and peaceful removal of obviously bad ones. 
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#16
Having to hide your guns is an indicator that it is time to use them.
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#17
(03-17-2013, 12:44 AM)Gunnen4u Wrote: Having to hide your guns is an indicator that it is time to use them.

Great post Tait! They should make that into a regular saying somewhere. S22

We've missed you. You haven't been out cold water rafting, have you?
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"Falsehood flies, and truth comes limping after it" - Jonathan Swift, 1710
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#18
Just been really busy with my school work is all. I don't have internet at my apartment, so I spend a lot of my time on homework or out doing something.

I am sure Yak or someone else will come by and tell me in so many posts that "using them" is nuts and not the thing to do when the ballot box has failed entirely to protect anything.
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