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Quote:Anger over plan to dig up 350,000 bodies in historic London cemetery for Muslim burial site

t is a peaceful resting place for 350,000 souls - an historic graveyard which now serves as a nature reserve.

But plans are afoot to dig up the ancient graves at Tower Hamlets Cemetery - and reopen it as a 21st century burial site.

Officially it would be known as a "multi-faith" cemetery but it is likely that it would principally answer calls for a Muslim graveyard in the largely-Asian East London borough.

The local newspaper has been bombarded with letters from historians and nature lovers declaring: "There is no way we'll allow them to dig up our ancestors."

But the Labour-controlled council's environment spokesman Abdal Ullah appeared to be in no doubt about the feasibility of the plan when he said: "To preserve the respect and dignity for everyone, I think most of the graves would have to be cleared out and we'd start afresh."

He said a corner of the cemetery would be reserved for Muslims who are buried in shrouds at a depth of 6ft and on their side facing Mecca.

By law, any graves more than 75 years old can be removed.

At the cemetery yesterday, liaison officer Ken Greenway - the only paid member of staff tending the 33-acre site - said he was astonished that anyone would even contemplate such a move.

"I'm against it and I have to stand up for that because of the huge value of this site today," he added.

"It's a beautiful haven for wildlife and people."

The City of London and Tower Hamlets Cemetery was opened in 1841 by an Act of Parliament.

During the Second World War it was bombed five times and some headstones still bear the marks of shrapnel hits.

Other markers have gone altogether, torn down when the graveyard was deconsecrated as a Church of England cemetery by another Act of Parliament in 1966 when it was deemed to be full.

The intention was to create an open space for the public, which led to two bomb-damaged chapels being demolished and a swathe of graves cleared.

In 1986 ownership passed from the Greater London Council to Tower Hamlets and in 1990 the Friends of the Tower Hamlets Cemetery Park was set up.

Seven years ago the park became the borough's first nature reserve and it is now tended by 1,600 volunteers.

It is home to 27 species of butterfly, a rare bumble bee, woodpeckers, sparrowhawks and the elusive firecrest.

Some 8,000 schoolchildren visit every year for outdoor nature lessons.

Professor David Bellamy, who is patron of the Friends of Tower Hamlets Cemetery Park, said: "Tower Hamlets Cemetery is still a place of peace and reflection as it has been since it was saved from becoming just another part of East London's urban sprawl.

"Now in its new guise as a local nature reserve and green lung, people of every colour, creed and kind share their humanity with that of other living things.

"I can only pray that the wisdom of all faiths can together discover the right way ahead for this very special part of East London's heritage."

Last night the council was insisting there were no plans to re-open the park as a cemetery.

"It is a popular and historic nature park and if there were any proposalsto alter the look or the functionality, there would be a full consultation with interested parties," said a spokesman.

However the council admitted it had been looking at "options" for burial sites.

And Lib Dem group leader Stephanie Eaton said she had received a letter from the council chief executive admitting the park was one of the options being considered.

The most appropriate place for Muslims to bury their dead is the London sewer system.
Does London have an underground, as does Paris, Rome, and many other European cities? If so, then they can use this and have a field day with it.
WarBicycle Wrote:The most appropriate place for Muslims to bury their dead is the London sewer system.
...and this thoughtless and offensive remark precludes any serious discussion.Wink1

Tellingly, you are joined by our 'civilised' admin.

You have shown your true colours more than once, it is a long time ago since you pretentiously called posters to order in the bearpit, John. Wink1
Stroll,

I think the most appropriate place for Muslims to bury their dead is in Islamic lands. Why this is controversial I do not know for their own doctrine teaches that non Muslims are filthy hogs and they are not to openly associate with us,so they should stay in Islamic purity I would think.

Things like in the url below are not uncommon in Muslim(communist,etc.) society,I see no reason a Muslim should venture with his/her culture into a non Muslim state:

HERE
John L Wrote:Does London have an underground, as does Paris, Rome, and many other European cities? If so, then they can use this and have a field day with it.
London's underground system "The Tube" is the World's oldest dating back to 1863. If you've ever had to use it, this fact is patently obvious.
stroll Wrote:
WarBicycle Wrote:The most appropriate place for Muslims to bury their dead is the London sewer system.
...and this thoughtless and offensive remark precludes any serious discussion.Wink1
Agreed; boorish and asinine.
Palladin Wrote:I think the most appropriate place for Muslims to bury their dead is in Islamic lands. Why this is controversial I do not know for their own doctrine teaches that non Muslims are filthy hogs and they are not to openly associate with us,so they should stay in Islamic purity I would think.
And the moronic Muslim bashing takes it's predictable course...but what else to expect on ai-jane? :roll:

Is it such an unusual request for British citizens in London to want to bury their dead nearby? And preferably not in soil which has been blessed or whatever you call it by Christian rituals?
Actually, it's not only the Muslims, but over the years more and more citizens are wishing to be buried according to their own wishes, not following standard Church practise.

It seems those slavering at the mouth at yet another opportunity to make snide and derogatory remarks about those evil Muslims know very little about the UK. :idea:
Monsieur Le Tonk Wrote:
stroll Wrote:
WarBicycle Wrote:The most appropriate place for Muslims to bury their dead is the London sewer system.
...and this thoughtless and offensive remark precludes any serious discussion.Wink1
Agreed; boorish and asinine.

Boorish and asinine are the salient features of Islam.
Stroll,

No,it makes imminent sense Muslims want to bury their dead in a graveyard formerly Christian. They would like to bury us there as well.

My point is Muslims,beliving the trash the Koran teaches about us,have no business living in our nations. Let them bury their dead in Muslimland.
^
Wrong on all counts.
Grow a brain, P.

But then, this topic was a opening for Muslim haters and Christian fanatics to post their ghoulish (excuse t he punt) drivel from the start. :roll:
I am not a bible thumper. Muslims in Birmingham, England have pressured the municipal government to change their cemeteries plot plan because Muslim custom requires that the graves be oriented northeast to southwest and the body placed on its right side facing east towards the birthplace of their prophet. The tradition in western culture is for graves to face east. In order to accommodate the Muslim demands in future everyone will be buried in the Muslim tradition. There is nothing preventing Muslims from purchasing vacant land and turning that into a cemetery. Catholics, Protestants and Jews have been doing this for centuries.
I guess I am a Bible thumper,but were I an atheist,I would ,based on Islam,believe Muslims are not proper citizens for non Islamic lands.

If their religion teaches they are superior to us,their ways are superior to ours and they are not to relate honestly with us and it DOES,it seems sort of logical we should consider those facts like we would with Nazis or communists when making such decisions.
WarBicycle Wrote:Muslims in Birmingham, England have pressured the municipal government to change their cemeteries plot plan because Muslim custom requires that the graves be oriented northeast to southwest and the body placed on its right side facing east towards the birthplace of their prophet. The tradition in western culture is for graves to face east. In order to accommodate the Muslim demands in future everyone will be buried in the Muslim tradition.
I'd love to see the source of that story :roll:
Quote:The council cemetery where Christians are given Muslim graves

A new cemetery is to have all its graves aligned with Mecca - making it the first council graveyard in the country to bury the dead in Islamic tradition, regardless of their religion.

Headstones in the new £2.5million High Wood Cemetery in Nottingham will face north-east - as Muslims believe the dead look over their shoulder towards Mecca. This is the way in which all followers of Islam in the UK are buried.

But the move has upset the Church and led to complaints that the policy discriminates against the city's majority Christian population. The traditional direction of burial for Christians is facing east.

The Bishop of Southwell and Nottingham, the Rt Rev George Cassidy, criticised the decision. He said: "This is a sensitive issue to all people. I hope the situation will be reviewed with wide consultation and a policy introduced that takes account of the needs of all."

The decision was made by Steve Dowling, Nottingham City Council's Services Director for Environment and Public Protection, after liaising with the city's multi-faith Cemeteries Consultative Committee.

He said: "For people of the Muslim faith this fits in with a religious requirement, but it will also ensure a tidy appearance for the site. People can choose to be buried facing another direction but if they do not specify that, they will be buried facing north-east. The vast majority of people do not express a preference."

But Brendan Clarke-Smith, Tory councillor for Clifton North, said: "I was totally bewildered when I read about this decision. I spoke to one of the local Muslim groups in my area and they were equally surprised by what had been done. It is utterly ridiculous and I know it'll create a lot of ill feeling both in Nottingham and the country generally."

The clergy and critics of the policy at the new 40-acre cemetery are supported by Raza Ul Haq, Imam at the Madni Masjid Mosque. He said: "It is part of our religion for the dead to be aligned with Mecca. It is very important. But for Christians, if they want to face somewhere else we support them."

Last night a spokesman for the Institute of Cemeteries and Crematorium Management said it was the first time he had heard of any public cemetery in Britain choosing to have all its gravestones facing north-east, in line with Muslim tradition.

"It is unusual,' he said. "It would seem appropriate if there was a large population of Muslims."

In Nottingham, however, Muslims make up less than five per cent of the region's 500,000 population.

Nigel Lymn Rose managing director of A.W. Lymn Funeral Directors, and a past president of the National Association of Funeral Directors, said Mr Dowling had told him of the decision when he went to High Wood for a site visit and asked whether Muslims had been taken into account.

He said: "I was astonished to be told, "Oh yes, we're burying everyone so they are aligned to Mecca. It will make things easier."

"It's one thing to be buried facing north-east because that is the way the cemetery lies, or the plot within it - it is quite another thing to learn that you have been buried facing that direction because it follows Islamic law."

Brian Grocock, a councillor who took part in the consultation process, said: "I don't know how this has become such a big issue.

"The consultations went on for three or four years. We had people of all faiths represented at the meetings - or they certainly had the chance to attend. Nobody I know had any objections to the plan."

So far at Highwood there have been just six burials - of which three were Muslim.


The article is a year old, I got the city wrong. Muslims represent only 5% of the municipality's population it would have made more sense to follow the norm, but make exceptions for Muslims that wanted to be buried in accordance with their beliefs.
Monsieur Le Tonk Wrote:
John L Wrote:Does London have an underground, as does Paris, Rome, and many other European cities? If so, then they can use this and have a field day with it.
London's underground system "The Tube" is the World's oldest dating back to 1863. If you've ever had to use it, this fact is patently obvious.

I was not referring to the subway Pepe. I was referring to the caves and catacombs.
Quote:Wrong on all counts.
Grow a brain, P.
stroll,
don't be unfair. He knows the essentials, Jesus of Nazareth and His true identity as the Son of God. He also knows he's one of the good guys because he's American with Judeo-Christian culture and individualist, which the collectivists are out to destroy. Therefore, communists, muslims and environmentalists must be killed before they kill good Christians.
quadrat Wrote:.... Therefore, communists, muslims and environmentalists must be killed before they kill good Christians.

Please provide reference to where Paladin suggested that communists, Muslims and environmentalists must be killed before they kill good Christians.
Long not seen, Seif. You've been brainwashed by those sons of the warlord or what else happened to your pic on the left? To your question, look the topics of the last days up yourself, Palladin has been on the warpath lately.
I see that he has been on the 'warpath' but I still can't find where he advicated the wholesale killing of all of those categories of people. I didn't manage to look through the majority of his posts however so I could have missed much.