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There is so much anti-americanism out there, I thought it would be interesting and also tonic for a thread in which U.S. citizens could discuss what they think of the rest of the world.

As I have travelled fairly extensively, I will begin...

In general, foreigners or others are much more timid than we are. They take what is to my American mind a very unrealistic view of the world in that they prefer pretending it is static to dealing effectively with the problems and opportunities change offers. I find while Americans are interested in problem solving and disdainfull of facade, others much prefer the maintenance of facade to effectively dealing with reality proactively. I find others are much less honest then Americans and that they tend to be quite cowardly both physically and intellectually. I find foriegners steal, for instance, look at their refusal to pay their debts or their stealing of American intellectual property. I also find they are shamefully dependent while pretending to want to stand up for themselves, when the chips are down they have no hesitation in demanding the U.S. save them (Kosovo, Bosnia). I also find that despite their loud poltically correct protestations, most of hte others are actually very biggoted... outrageously so on an American scale.
I wonder why it is in the face of all the anti-americanism Americans do not want to respond in kind?
Yankeecat Wrote:There is so much anti-americanism out there, I thought it would be interesting and also tonic for a thread in which U.S. citizens could discuss what they think of the rest of the world.

As I have travelled fairly extensively, I will begin...

In general, foreigners or others are much more timid than we are. They take what is to my American mind a very unrealistic view of the world in that they prefer pretending it is static to dealing effectively with the problems and opportunities change offers. I find while Americans are interested in problem solving and disdainfull of facade, others much prefer the maintenance of facade to effectively dealing with reality proactively. I find others are much less honest then Americans and that they tend to be quite cowardly both physically and intellectually. I find foriegners steal, for instance, look at their refusal to pay their debts or their stealing of American intellectual property. I also find they are shamefully dependent while pretending to want to stand up for themselves, when the chips are down they have no hesitation in demanding the U.S. save them (Kosovo, Bosnia). I also find that despite their loud poltically correct protestations, most of hte others are actually very biggoted... outrageously so on an American scale.

I believe that one of the most important, and glaring shortcomings, with foreigners, Euros in particular, is that they have a higher sense of entitlement, than we Americans. Many of the world believe that they are entitled to free "fill in the blank". They believe that the State is the benevolent Mama/Papa figure, which will take care of them from cradle to grave. They also believe that stealing from others is a natural thing, that is accepted, since the beneficiaries are gaining a "leg up" on them, and must be further subjected to the ravages of Collectivist "Egalitarianism".

There are several things missing from the equation, which make this possible. One, a serious loss of morality, that has been the role of Christianity for centuries. Just look at the Euros, who have turned away from their Christian heritage, and compare that to their subsequent slide. Two, is the rise of Franco-German Collectivist Socialism. With Any collectivist socitey, initiative, imagination, being a self-starter, and over-acheiver, is frowned upon.

There are, of course, other factors, but I look at those two attributes to be the most serious shortcomings throughout the world. And incidentially, it has spread here, to this country. We have several here, who are perfect examples. I have favorites, but I will refrain from pointing fingers. Wink1
Both of you are correct in your analysis of Europeans. Anyone or any people who spend so much time worrying about the short comings of others, such as those fat Americans, those greedy Americans, those Christian Americans, truely hate themselves. They can't deal with themselves so they must destroy others to make themselves feel better.

Quote:I wonder why it is in the face of all the anti-americanism Americans do not want to respond in kind?

Well the truth is we don't care what others think or say. That's a good thing because it puts the focus on our own behavior and not that of others. It helps us build our country but tends to hurt us when we fail to recognize gathering threats abroad. Europeans believe we ignore the world because we think we're better than everyone.

I can tell you I'm one of the very few Americans that believes that. Most Americans worry about making the country better and have no time for pointing at other countries. I believe we are superior to Europeans because of this. I'm a rare type, I do believe our culture while not perfect is the best in the world right now. When the pilgrims came to America they were the Creme de la Creme. What was left behind was the crap de la crap. :lol:

Europeans deserve themselves. I'll say this again, not one drop of blood nor treasure should go to defending these people. They are to solve their own problems and ultimately it is good for them. Nothing gets you in the right set of mind than a good fight. Wink1
I didn't bother to respond because:
#1 There was a thread about this already not more than a week ago
#2 I don't really care what Europeans think of the US
Independents4Bush Wrote:Both of you are correct in your analysis of Europeans. Anyone or any people who spend so much time worrying about the short comings of others, such as those fat Americans, those greedy Americans, those Christian Americans, truely hate themselves. They can't deal with themselves so they must destroy others to make themselves feel better.
The sad truth is, that we don't care what you yanks do within your own country, but the fat ugly imbeciles are continually bothering everyone else on the planet, it's kind of hard to ignore the scum. :roll:
If you believe what you wrote you are delusional. If you are not delusional you are in denial. In any event, the idea that the U.S. has been anything but a huge net positive for the planet is not only incorrect but inane.
Yankeecat Wrote:If you believe what you wrote you are delusional. If you are not delusional you are in denial. In any event, the idea that the U.S. has been anything but a huge net positive for the planet is not only incorrect but inane.

Yankee, Envy and Hubris are the two greatest impediments to good will and progress. Clearly, Euros such as sTroll, are chock full of both. Unfortunately, this is the norm in Europe. Rather than blame themselves, it is far easier to blame others, for their troubles.
Some Europeans are like our Coloradons...SEND US ALL YOUR MONEY, BUT STAY HOME AND DON'T MESS UP OUR BEAUTIFUL MOUNTAINS.

lol lol lol
Bean
The level of th anti-americanism out there now is so ludicrous and pathetic that I am actually beginning to feel embarrased for and even worried about some of these foriegners. Do they not realize that there is going to be a cost for what is beginning to look like a sociopathic rant?

As we say in the U.S., Actions have consequences.
Yankeecat Wrote:The level of th anti-americanism out there now is so ludicrous and pathetic that I am actually beginning to feel embarrased for and even worried about some of these foriegners. Do they not realize that there is going to be a cost for what is beginning to look like a sociopathic rant?

As we say in the U.S., Actions have consequences.

I think that it should also be noted that the anti-American crowd are pretty much the most vocal. Because of this, we tend to see only them. There is a substantial percentage, who really don't look on us as we are led to believe. Further, remember that most of those polled will not be solidly disposed one way or the other, only relying of spur of the moment sensations, that the MSM tend to give them.

I suspect that there are many more, who actually think of us as Good Guys, than Bad Guys. Seif is a great example of this. Have you read his posts of late? It is quite heartening, I must say. But remember, he is not out there shouting it from the rooftops, like many of his opposite numbers.
Seif is brave enough as it is. If he shouted from the roof tops he'd put himself at great risk. As far as Europe is concerned I am torn as to which is the best course. To let them grow a pair or prevent them the opportunity. If they don't grow a pair they can never be a threat to us. Their envy won't materialize into any serious threat.

If we do allow them to grow a pair they might turn on us some time down the road. Maybe a muslim society in Europe assimilated to western europe with the slow erosion of european anglos wouldn't be a bad thing. I know it sounds pie in the sky but it could happen and would be of great benefit to the world.
Independents4Bush Wrote:Seif is brave enough as it is. If he shouted from the roof tops he'd put himself at great risk. As far as Europe is concerned I am torn as to which is the best course. To let them grow a pair or prevent them the opportunity. If they don't grow a pair they can never be a threat to us. Their envy won't materialize into any serious threat.

If we do allow them to grow a pair they might turn on us some time down the road. Maybe a muslim society in Europe assimilated to western europe with the slow erosion of european anglos wouldn't be a bad thing. I know it sounds pie in the sky but it could happen and would be of great benefit to the world.

Unfortunately, Europe is the home of "Western Civilization". It would be to our best interests not to allow it to die out, because clearly Western Civilization is the premier one on the planet. We can't afford to let them die out. Besides, I believe they will finally get their acts together, sooner or later.
Yankeecat Wrote:The level of th anti-americanism out there now is so ludicrous and pathetic that I am actually beginning to feel embarrased for and even worried about some of these foriegners. Do they not realize that there is going to be a cost for what is beginning to look like a sociopathic rant?

As we say in the U.S., Actions have consequences.
Ever thought about why that might be so? Have you read the threads about the opinion polls? :roll:

"a cost" - is this a threat, are you going to invade Europe and kill all the "America-haters"??? :lol:

Get your own country sorted out first, take note of the 50% of voters who "hate America" by the right-wing patriots' standards!
-good luck! 8)
Here is an example of european delusion in the form of a policy paper byt the French socialists...

http://iht.nytimes.com/protected/article...php?page=2

This is exactly what I mean by europe's anti-american socio-pathology.
stroll, would you give any one of those gentlemen a job in an enterprise of your own? John, ok, he seems to be the oldest of the pack, but the only one who would respond to the due denazification. :lol: He's educated, too. The rest are no-goods.
Ally with them? The very idea is a joke. We must somehow restrict their access to Europe. By declaring America a third-world country? Should we store some yankeecat postings at Calcutta standard as evidence?
Yankeecat Wrote:Here is an example of european delusion in the form of a policy paper byt the French socialists...

http://iht.nytimes.com/protected/article...php?page=2

This is exactly what I mean by europe's anti-american socio-pathology.
Unfortunately, the article is for subscribers only.
The French socialists, whatever this article is about, are not representative of Europe, however much they wish to be.

But then, shouldn't you be grateful to your friends who enabled and supported the terrorist uprising against the crown?
The French gave you the statue of liberty as well, remember?
Remember what it stands for?
quadrat Wrote:stroll, would you give any one of those gentlemen a job in an enterprise of your own? John, ok, he seems to be the oldest of the pack, but the only one who would respond to the due denazification. :lol: He's educated, too. The rest are no-goods.
I don't share your positive sentiment towards John, I've known him much longer and initially gave him the benefit of the doubt.

Anyway, my business is too small to employ anyone overseas, but there are plenty of decent yanks out there I wouldn't mind working with on a commission basis.
A New-Age Californian Hippie could be the way into the US-market for me, I sold to them via proxy before.
Yankeecat Wrote:Here is an example of european delusion in the form of a policy paper byt the French socialists...

http://iht.nytimes.com/protected/article...php?page=2

This is exactly what I mean by europe's anti-american socio-pathology.


Why don't you go to the subscription site and copy and paste it to this thread? Then we can read it here. Wink1
http://www.iht.com/protected/articles/20...balist.php[/code]



International Herald Tribune
Globalist: United States as the anti-France
Roger Cohen
Tuesday, January 30, 2007
NEW YORK

Does the United States, the real country, exist in the French mind, or has America become a kind of Gallic fantasy, a dark specter to be deployed for political ends, a sort of ultimate negative against which the qualities of France shine?

That question may seem outlandish. The web of connections between the two countries is intricate. In general it is easier to fantasize about the unknown than the known. But the United States seems curiously impervious to French knowledge because the French prefer to preserve the country in the realm of the imaginary.

There are deep roots to this fantasy. Some lie in the rivalry of two universalizing powers, in the Gaullist myths forged to rebuild French pride after the humiliations of World War II, and in the persistence of a left-of-center political culture that holds Yankee free market forces to be anathema.

Being the anti- France, the United States, it often seems, cannot be seen for what it is. So freighted is America with meaning, it ceases to be visible. It becomes an abstraction shaped by prejudice rather than a country intelligible through experience. It serves a purpose at the price of being severed from itself.

These reflections stirred on reading an eloquent example of Gallic delusion: the statement just published by Ségolène Royal's Socialist Party about Nicolas Sarkozy, her chief opponent in the French presidential election. This 87-page work amounts to a relentless exercise in Sarkozy-bashing through his depiction as that incarnation of menace: a card-carrying crypto-American.

Entitled "The Worrying 'Quiet Rupture' of Mr. Sarkozy," and displayed on Parti-socialiste.fr, the party's home page, the work begins by asking: "Is France ready to vote in 2007 for an American neo-conservative carrying a French passport?"

That gets the ball rolling. The party's core argument runs roughly as follows: America is bad, Sarkozy is its agent, ergo he is dangerous. The publication really has little more to say about Royal's center-right rival.

One chapter is entitled "Nicolas Sarkozy or the Clone of Bush." A memorable sentence, among many such gems, says: "Yesterday Europe was importing jeans, coke, rock 'n' roll and cinema from the United States. Now Nicolas Sarkozy is proposing that we import God!"

Apart from shipping God from Galveston to Dieppe and so destroying the lay French state, Sarko is accused of heading up "a sort of French subsidiary of Bush and company." He's said to manipulate the suffering of French Jews to partisan ends and to pander with equal unscrupulousness to the sensibilities of Catholics and Muslims.

"When one listens to Sarkozy, one would think one was listening to the evangelist George W. Bush addressing Hispanics of Catholic tradition in the last campaign," the pamphlet opines.

Really?

The Socialist Party portrait of American society evokes a place rotten to the core, stricken by obesity and a high murder rate, driving exploited workers to the limits of endurance, imprisoning 2 percent of its population, engaged in a failed affirmative action experiment that has only "made a racial issue of all problems," and beset by an ominous religious fervor.

The real U.S. unemployment rate, it is preposterously suggested, is not 5.1 percent, but 9 percent. America under Bush has no interest in international law because its sole international aim is "the promotion of the American empire."

The death penalty, torture, renditions, secret prisons, short or non-existent vacations, absent or expensive health care, a Darwinian labor market and the worship of "the individualist entrepreneur" complete this happy picture of France's ally.

"It is in this," the Socialists conclude triumphantly, "that Nicolas Sarkozy sees the future of French society!"

There are a couple of problems with all this. The first is that although some of the individual claims have some merit — a health care system that leaves more than 40 million people without insurance is a bad system — the composite picture is wildly distorted, a collage of doom and gloom.

The America in which French companies from Accor to Business Objects prosper, which grows and creates jobs in ways France can only dream of, which is restlessly self- transforming rather than irksomely self-obsessed, which has assured the postwar European security from which France and the European Union have benefited — this United States is nowhere to be seen.

The second is that although Sarkozy has been happy enough at times to don the mantle of the American agent provocateur — man of action, man of movement, man unafraid to suggest you should earn more for working more — he's been rowing back of late toward the Gaullist mainstream. In this light, Bush clone sounds like quite a stretch.

Sarkozy has criticized the Iraq war as a mistake. He has sounded a lot more wary of globalization. He has emphasized the important role of the state as a "regulator."

In short, he is toning down his neo- Liberal credentials, never entirely convincing, and adjusting his image from brash ideologue to competent pragmatist.

"The Socialist line of attack is weaker now because Sarkozy is playing the neo-Gaullist rather than the liberal card," said Stephane Rozes, a political analyst. "Moreover, America is an ambivalent rather than negative image for many in France."

That ambivalence may be tending more positive as the end of the Bush era looms and the French are able to indulge their Kennedy fantasy — the perennial notion that some JFK-like figure, in this case Barack Obama, will emerge to personify the French idea of what America ought to be.

That idea is not altogether clear, but it is safe to say it owes more to the West Village than Western Kansas, and more to Woody Allen than Allen Dulles.

The Socialists, in their Bush obsession, cite Sarkozy's reply to a question about how, if at all, Bush differs from him. "He's been elected president twice," is Sarko's pithy response.

Say what you like about the candidate of the Union for a Popular Movement, he looks the facts in the eye, more so at least than his America- mangling detractors.

E-mail: rocohen@nytimes.com

Tomorrow: Alan Riding examines an arts festival as a tool for development.
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