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Bush can account only for some of this.



http//news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20060703/od_afp/britainuspopularitypoll
I don't doubt this. I was making another point in the other thread, but you're right. I don't see Britain in the course they're on presently as being a particularly dependable ally in the war against terror - and they're the best we have from that continent. China is much better. We control major sectors of their economy, and they don't get so hamstrung over notions of international law.

OTOH, some of these differences are overblown.
Quote:81 per cent of those who took a view said President George W Bush hypocritically championed democracy as a cover for the pursuit of American self-interests.
Homer Simpson: I think you (staged your invasion of Iraq) on purpose.
Crowd: Gasp!
I made a similar point in another thread or forum, that according to apparently reliable surveys done in many other countries, the reputation of the USA, and its leadership, is very unpopular since Bush began his terroristic war on something ending in "-ism." The response I got from one participant in the debate is typical of the Bush regime: "I don't care what they think of us."

The trouble is, "they" are the former allies of the USA, and my great grandchildren (and yours) will never have the money to pay off the debts that it's costing the US Treasury to be the cop of the world, the world's only rapidly declining, overspending supercop.

Most reasonably well educated folks in Europe and other developed countries see American citizens as individuals, separate from our government; others don't see the distinction. We as a country don't have the friends we had just ten years ago, and we might just eventually need friends instead of enemies.
Quote:In answer to other questions, a majority of the Britons questions described Americans as uncaring, divided by class, awash in violent crime, vulgar, preoccupied with money, ignorant of the outside world, racially divided, uncultured and in the most overwhelming result (90 percent of respondents) dominated by big business.

I think this is just a recycled Guardian poll from the 1970s. When I lived in Scotland 30 years ago, they were saying the exact same things. I don't believe that GWB has 'harmed' the reputation of the US. Most of Europe has despised the US for at least 30+ years. Anybody who thinks the low opinion of the US in Europe started with GWB is a complete dumba$$. BTW, there are a lot of complete dumba$$es.

-S
Stars & Stripes Wrote:
Quote:In answer to other questions, a majority of the Britons questions described Americans as uncaring, divided by class, awash in violent crime, vulgar, preoccupied with money, ignorant of the outside world, racially divided, uncultured and in the most overwhelming result (90 percent of respondents) dominated by big business.

I think this is just a recycled Guardian poll from the 1970s. When I lived in Scotland 30 years ago, they were saying the exact same things. I don't believe that GWB has 'harmed' the reputation of the US. Most of Europe has despised the US for at least 30+ years. Anybody who thinks the low opinion of the US in Europe started with GWB is a complete dumba$$. BTW, there are a lot of complete dumba$$es.

-S

thats a bit harsh....I spent quite some time in Europe and no one I ever met despised the US. in fact most admired the US...even if the hated our foreign policy.

For some reason...people like our movies, music, and culture.
Here's the best (only) research I found, from the Pew Research Center:

America's Image Slips, But Allies Share U.S. Concerns Over Iran, Hamas
No Global Warming Alarm in the U.S., China

Released: 06.13.06

Summary of Findings

America's global image has again slipped and support for the war on terrorism has declined even among close U.S. allies like Japan. The war in Iraq is a continuing drag on opinions of the United States, not only in predominantly Muslim countries but in Europe and Asia as well. And despite growing concern over Iran's nuclear ambitions, the U.S. presence in Iraq is cited at least as often as Iran - and in many countries much more often - as a danger to world peace.

The rest of the article can be found at http://pewglobal.org/reports/display.php?ReportID=252

Speaking of Scotland, the report shows that while the US govt. found an approval rating among people in the UK at 83% in 1999/2000, and the Pew report showed a rating of 75% in 2002, that rating has now slipped to 56%, and Spain has decreased to 23%.

I'm living overseas, and am in contact by internet with thousands of expatriates from all the developed countries. The USA is not popular, period, full stop.

Oh, but sure enough, they love our movies, music, cosmetics, toys, etc.
Fit2BThaied Wrote:Oh, but sure enough, they love our movies, music, cosmetics, toys, etc.

What this means is that they like the fruits of our system, yet are envious of us making use of it. Yet, they are unable, or unwilling to take any responsibility, so they willingly nod to our lead, and hate themselves AND us for it.

Hypocrites!
And that begs the question. OBL's approval ratings are dropping, but how many Muslims are hypocrites when it comes to this subject as well?
b5d Wrote:And that begs the question. OBL's approval ratings are dropping, but how many Muslims are hypocrites when it comes to this subject as well?

Don't know. I will defer to you on that one. Wink1
I think Bush is just a catalyst myself. They didn't like the USA in the 1970s when I was a teen and I doubt it's changed so much. Think to the 1980s,they said then Reagan was why they thought so lowly about the USA.

This poll indicates the hostility is more personal than just blaming Bush.
Fit2BThaied Wrote:Here's the best (only) research I found, from the Pew Research Center:

America's Image Slips, But Allies Share U.S. Concerns Over Iran, Hamas
No Global Warming Alarm in the U.S., China

Released: 06.13.06

Summary of Findings

America's global image has again slipped and support for the war on terrorism has declined even among close U.S. allies like Japan. The war in Iraq is a continuing drag on opinions of the United States, not only in predominantly Muslim countries but in Europe and Asia as well. And despite growing concern over Iran's nuclear ambitions, the U.S. presence in Iraq is cited at least as often as Iran - and in many countries much more often - as a danger to world peace.

The rest of the article can be found at http://pewglobal.org/reports/display.php?ReportID=252

Speaking of Scotland, the report shows that while the US govt. found an approval rating among people in the UK at 83% in 1999/2000, and the Pew report showed a rating of 75% in 2002, that rating has now slipped to 56%, and Spain has decreased to 23%.

I'm living overseas, and am in contact by internet with thousands of expatriates from all the developed countries. The USA is not popular, period, full stop.

Oh, but sure enough, they love our movies, music, cosmetics, toys, etc.


That is part of our popularity though. I don't understand why you think our image is based SOLEY on the gov't? :?
My basic response is,don't call us next time you get your wormy cans in a crack like your daddy's did twice before.

Go ahead and take your troops back out of Iraq and Afghanistan,you need them to fight al qaeda in Londonistan anyway.
Palladin Wrote:My basic response is,don't call us next time you get your wormy cans in a crack like your daddy's did twice before.

Go ahead and take your troops back out of Iraq and Afghanistan,you need them to fight al qaeda in Londonistan anyway.

ouch :lol:
Neo,

No sense in dishonesty,we've lost several hundred thousand helping them fight their fights. Fine with me if we stay home on the next big one.

I never have understood our fascination with alliances anyway. Washington sure didn't have an affinity for them.
The British have believed America to be a right-wing country for a long time. My dad remembers that after the Gingrich revolution in 1994, British commentotrs were all convinced that radical Republicans had totally seized control of the country.
Quote:thats a bit harsh....I spent quite some time in Europe and no one I ever met despised the US. in fact most admired the US...even if the hated our foreign policy.

Hmmm... We're broadly talking about Europeans' perceptions of the US, and more specifically those of Britons... I use the word "despised" and you say that's too harsh... then you use the word "hate" with respect to our relationships with other countries. It seems as though you were basically supporting my statement while simultaneously saying you disagree. I guess there is a subtle difference here that I'm not quite grasping.


Quote:For some reason...people like our movies, music, and culture.

Neocon, read the last paragraph of the article. Britons/Europeans may like some of our movies and music, but overall Britons certainly do not like American culture.

-S

Quote:a majority of the Britons questions described Americans as uncaring, divided by class, awash in violent crime, vulgar, preoccupied with money, ignorant of the outside world, racially divided, uncultured and in the most overwhelming result (90 percent of respondents) dominated by big business.
Coincidentally, I'm actually in Britain(Bristol to be exact) right now.
Well, thank heavens not all blokes "feel" the same about this. All one has to do is simply pick up the latest Christopher Hitchens article, to see what the logical minority actually "think" of the relationship.

BTY, this is a great 4th of July message as well.


Quote:Thus, for a Fourth of July message, I would suggest less masochism, more confidence on the American street, and less nervous reliance on paper majorities discovered by paper organizations.

Happy Independence Day.

So, who cares what the "feelers" feel?

And to add insult to injury, check out this little piece about the Outrageous "Flag Epidemic" within the US that is at it's venile worst on July 4th. I shutter to think of the consequences. BTY, this story is being waved around, pardon the pun, by the MSM all over the place, but it is actually from our friends the French at Agence France Presse. Then again, what difference the Euro MSM and our own?


Quote:US 'flag epidemic' reaches peak on Fourth of July

by Chantal Valery
Tue Jul 4, 1:16 PM ET

It's a true epidemic: the red, white and blue, stars-and-stripes banners are everywhere in the United States - on house facades, front lawns, cars and clothes.

Hitting an high point on the July 4 US Independence Day holiday, it is a genuine phenomenon of American national pride that, inevitably, gets a good but also sometimes unwanted boost from commercial exploitation.

"It's a little strange, this obsession of the flag," French author Bernard-Henri Levy wrote after traveling across the country.

"Everywhere, in every form, flapping in the wind or on stickers, an epidemic of flags that has spread throughout the city," Levy wrote in "American Vertigo" of the riot of banners he saw.

"Old Glory," as the US flag is affectionately called, can be seen in abundance through the year in the American heartland and the South, and to a lesser extent in cities like New York and Los Angeles.

Patriotic flag-waving strengthened in the aftermath of the September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, and increased even more with the beginning of the war in Iraq as a testament of support for President George W. Bush.

But the phenomenon hits its peak each year around the Fourth of July, when it becomes the focus of intense advertising and commercial promotions.

Quote:Coincidentally, I'm actually in Britain(Bristol to be exact) right now.

I hope you are having an enjoyable trip.

I am curious as to one thing: Are you openly traveling as an American? Or are you pretending to be Canadian?

-S
Anon,

They probably said the same in 1982 when Reagan was POTUS as well,we didn't have internet to know all this back then.

I bet they didn't like us in 1945 when the war was over either.

"Overpaid,oversexed and overhere".

You tell your British friends to lose our phone number and we'll be sure to lose theirs.
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