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WoW! This is truely monumental if correct, and coming from a Muslim schollar, I tend to believe it at face value.

Here at this Ex-Muslim site, EROS comments on the fact that there are at least 6 million Muslims leaving their faith annually in Africa alone. I have yet to read the entire translation, but will get around to it. It is most revealing and Militant Muslims will be angry with this. This should be a wake up call for a change in the manner in which Islam is practiced. I wonder if kamil has been on this forum and can tell us about it.

Anyway, here is a timely article on The American Thinker, concerning the flight of Apostates. And others have estimated that the rate is even higher than this.



Quote:Six million African Muslims leave Islam per year



This translation of a televised conversation reveals a rare glimpse into the outlook of Muslim scholars who are concerned about Christianity’s growth. The invited guest is Sheikh Ahmad Al Katani; the president of The Companions Lighthouse for the Science of Islamic Law in Libya, which is an institution specializing in graduating imams and Islamic preachers.

Katani starts off describing the overall problem:

Islam used to represent, as you previously mentioned, Africa’s main religion and there were 30 African languages that used to be written in Arabic script. The number of Muslims in Africa has diminished to 316 million, half of whom are Arabs in North Africa. So in the section of Africa that we are talking about, the non Arab section, the number of Muslims does not exceed 150 million people. When we realize that the entire population of Africa is one billion people, we see that the number of Muslims has diminished greatly from what it was in the beginning of the last century. On the other hand, the number of Catholics has increased from one million in 1902 to 329 million 882 thousand (329,882,000). Let us round off that number to 330 million in the year 2000.

As to how that happened, well there are now 1.5 million churches whose congregations account for 46 million people. In every hour, 667 Muslims convert to Christianity. Everyday, 16,000 Muslims convert to Christianity. Ever year, 6 million Muslims convert to Christianity. These numbers are very large indeed …..

From what I have heard from reliable sources, six million may be too low. Reliable accounts say that one hundred thousand Africans convert to Christianity per day, though not all of them come from Islam. Then Katani says Muslims should build schools before mosques, in order to build the worshipper (Muslim) before the building. Why? To stop the the dangerous “Christian missionary octopus”

This happens often! The wealthy Arab builds a mosque for himself or one of his parents of his friend, but my dear sir, building a mosque comes as a second stage. In America, the price of building an Islamic school is 5 million dollars. In Africa, 50 thousand dollars are enough to build a very reasonably sized school. I say this and I take full responsibility for it; building a school comes before building a mosque. Build the worshiper before you build the mosque. Take for example yourself; you go to the mosque five times a day and if you added all that time it would equal an hour or maybe two hours if you include the Friday prayer. However, if I ask you how long you stayed at school, you will reply that you spent years in middle school and years in high school. Likewise the African goes to the mosque, but if we built him a school where he could spend most of his time, and provided specialized educators we could at least stop this dangerous Christian missionary octopus.

Katani states the purpose of his school:

The truth is, the institution that I administer is considered pre-college. As for the subject of attracting and preparing specialized missionaries to bring them from their countries to Libya in order to train them and return them back to their countries, that is done through the Islamic Propagation Organization. This organization has graduated a number of classes, some of whose students had masters and doctorate degrees. These efforts were fruitful in that these graduates were able to attract people from their lands and countries because they spoke the language and understood the customs of the people they were proselytizing. This way, the missionary is not a foreigner to the community he is working with, contrast that to what would happen if I went to the Philippines for example. I can’t speak a single Philippino word; much less invite people to the faith.

By now other Muslim leaders have joined in. Abbas Hamid lives in Holland, and he deplores the un-Islamic way of life:

My brother may Allah reward you. We muslims in Holland suffer a lot when we see issues like this and we really suffer when we see a muslim, as the sheikh said, who spends millions in bars and entertainment while other muslims are lost and cannot find a translation of the Koran. Even their children who are able to learn cannot memorize the Koran, they can’t find a translated Koran or even any translated book. The first thing we must do is mend our selves; the Islamic countries must fix themselves first and then they can look at Africa. May Allah reward you and this issue is interesting.

Later, an Arabic-speaking Christian discusses how Islam must preach peace and love. No one denies, as none of the Muslim scholars do, that a religion has the right to spread his faith (except in hard line Islamic countries), but these leaders seem panicky. They express frustration at Islam’s disorganized efforts to maintain Africa. But this one idea eludes them: Islam itself is the problem because it is a burdensome and harsh religion. This is apparent when one Muslim scholar talks about implementing Shari’ah as if it is self-evident that it benefits society.

The whole conversation is fascinating. Though the scroll bar indicates that it is a long dialogue, much of the file includes threads or comments at the bottom. So read the whole thing, please. We must educate ourselves about Islam, and with the worldwide web, we have unprecedented opportunities. James M. Arlandson 5 03 06
John.

I read that earlier today . I think it's bs. I WISH it were true.

I have a friend from Nigeria who goes to Africa several times annually.

Nigeria,Gambia,Cameroon are states with fairly large Islamic adherents.

He has some Muslims converts,but it is not a serious number. I don't buy this at all.
Wait a minute! What is it that you think is BS? The point that so many are becoming Apostates? Did you go to the Ex-Muslim site and read the report?

Personally, I can well believe this. I honestly believe that Islam is not a natural state for humans. It must constantly be enforced with the threat of death, to maintain it's numbers. That is why I am convinced that Christianity is Still the fastest growing religion.

And for a reason. It offers hope in the form of love, honesty, and reward for good deeds. Where Jesus asks for you to believe, Islam Demands that you do so upon pain of death. Which would you welcome?
Slowly I get around reading threads at different forums, but a lot of times the subject is an old news by the time I read it :roll:

However, Religions in Africa seems like is a timeless subject. Unfortunately my knowledge of African Religions is very limited.

I remember reading journals of a Turkish Traveler to Africa some 30 years back, so I don't know if his observations would be still true today.

From what I remember, he observed that most Christians and Moslems in Africa were not true Christians and Moslems, but in limbo between their original African Religions and the new religions. Also many of the African rituals has been incorporated into African Christianity and Islam, therefore it is very hard to figure out what religion Africans follow at a given time.
John,

I don't see the evidence that Muslims in BLACK Africa are rapidly converting to Christiantiy. I have an active missionary friend who evangelizes in the upper regions where Islam is fairly powerful and we just do not see such evidence. It's a large organization,too. Grace Evangelistic Ministries operates from Kenya to Zimbabwe,based in Jos,Nigeria. My daughter attends Church with the missionary in Nashville when he is home.

Having an organization on the ground is better evidence than reading a piece in the internet,don't you think?

Concerning your logic on "what would I believe". Yea,I chose to believe in Christ,but the Bible itself instructs us that the highway to Heaven is narrow and the road to perdition is wide indeed.

MOST HUMANS believe the lie,John. Most will perish forever in hell,don't use human viewpoint to try and figure out the future of either Christianity or Islam. Incidentally,due to my specific personality,HAD I rejected Christ,I would be an agnostic,no way am I going to ever run around trying to earn the approbation of a perfect God on my works,I know I am not worthy.
Patrick, since I know you all too well, I will assume that you did not bother to read the interview. I realize that you have other fish to fry, but I suggest you put your fish down and take the time and give it a 'go'.
John,

I read it days before you posted it and the 2cd paragraph infers that the loss within Islam is the gain within Catholicism. Another paragraph infers an astonishing "fact" that is not seen by the GEM associates

***In every hour, 667 Muslims convert to Christianity. Everyday, 16,000 Muslims convert to Christianity. Ever year, 6 million Muslims convert to Christianity. These numbers are very large indeed ….***

Again,GEM is a huge Christian missionary organization that operates from Kenya to Zimbabwe and parts in between,stationed in Jos,Nigeria. Associates are both Americans and Africans. They have operated in Gambia,Cameroon,Nigeria and Ghana which have large Muslim populations. They operate in Kenya 35% Muslim,Congo,Zimbabwe,Rwanda. They do see Muslims convert to Christ,but the numbers are not large. I trust them more than this article ,they operate on the ground and run the risks of martyrdom among these people.
That does seem more likely, I have not heard the missionaries my Church supports report huge successes in converting Muslims. I suspect that this Muslim scholar is exaggerating, or at least using dodgy stats, to make his fellow Muslims fell under threat.
Don't assume that all the Moslems in Africa who are converting to Christianity are becoming Catholics. The Seventh-day Adventist Church maintains the largest missionary presence in Africa second only to the Catholic church. There are about 22,900 SDA churches and five million Seventh-day Adventists in Africa (at least half of them converts within the past ten years). This rapid growth is largely resulting from the enormous commitment the church makes to eduction and medical work. The SDA Church maintains in Africa nine universities and colleges, two seminaries, and 75 secondary schools. The medical work in Africa includes about six hospitals, and 310 clinics, dispensaries, and other medical facilities.
From all the specific statistics I have seen, the rapidly growing Christianity in Africa is Charismatic christianity, such as pentacostalism. Would that include Seventh Day Adventists? I don't really know much about them (which is quite embaressing, as I lived next door to the daughter of one of their top people, and she was doing missionary work at the time).
Seventh-day Adventists are not Pentecostals. They go in for soundly reasoned doctrine based on clear exegesis of Scripture, and emphasize education and healthful living according to sound medical principles and living in accord with Leviticus 11, and avoiding any use of alcoholic beverages or tobacco. SDAs do not go in for highly emotional demonstrations such as the ecstatic utterances favored by Pentecostals. SDAs believe that the legitimate gift of tongues is the ability to speak in other languages without having learned them previously, and believe that other spiritual gifts should be emphasized more.

Since SDAs do not eat pork or drink alcohol, they have a somewhat easier time connecting with Moslems.

My church had a pastor some years ago, Mordecai Dushay, who grew up Jewish. When he first converted to Christianity, he became a Pentecostal to start with, because he was attracted by their warmth and loving spirit. But after a while, he got tired of the "anything goes" attitude about doctrine, and he became attracted to Seventh-day Adventists because they do have a consistent, systematic theology; and they keep the right Sabbath, so he did not have to give up everything in his Jewish heritage. He was fond of saying that he found in Christ his Jewish Messiah.

Mort told me one time about an experience he had singing in the choir when he was in the Pentecostal church. He recognized the song they were singing as a translation and melody from a song he knew from Hebrew school, and just on a lark started singing the words in Hebrew. After a few moments, he found a circle of quiet growing around him, as people began turning and staring at him open-mouthed. They thought he was "singing in tongues." (Actually he was, in a way.)
Ron,

My LIMITED knowledge of the conversions in Africa is specifically related to my friendship with a missionary who is active in the states I related above. I know they have had some Islamic converts,but when it happens I generally get an e-mail from a lady who lives near me and she tells us about them. I don't get many of those type reports.

His GEM ministry is really active and they are into a lot more than just evangelizing,they are working extremely hard with a group of native pastors over there to AVOID the errors of the pentecostal movement and other schisms in the Church bedeviling many of us.

Part of their ministry is sound Biblical teaching via proper exegesis and Isagogics. They seek to evangelize the body of Christ to get with the program Biblically as well as evangelizing the lost African(and Indian and Pakistani and Briton and Pole and German,they are all over the place).

Unfortunately,Africans are emotional people and the charasmatic movement is an easy sell to them. I fell for it as a young man,but when I failed to "speak in tongues" after trying real hard,a gentleman in my workplace led me into a more Biblical ministry and I have always felt it was not a mistake I ended up working near that gentleman.
Palladin, if you have attended predominately black churches here in America, you will notice that they tend to be much more emotionally and physically demonstrative, with frequent "Amens" and "Praise the Lords" etc. while the preacher is preaching. They do this without going to the extreme of being Pentecostal. Maybe the demonstrativeness is a cultural thing.

Pentecostals can be warm and loving churches, very welcoming to new people coming in from something like Judaism (like my friend, Pastor Mordecai). But the emphasis upon proving that you are really "saved" and among the inner circle of favored ones by exhibitiing "speaking in tongues" is not spiritually healthy. It sets up a legalistic test, and encourages people to fake a spiritual gift--or even worse, to give themselves over to something uncontrolled, which could open the door to demonic influence and domination in their lives. While the Holy Spirit also can lead people to give surprising demonstrations of emotion (and we cannot always presume to be able to judge the difference), He seldom does today, because it is so commonly abused and made to be the whole point of the worship experience.

In all of the New Testament, speaking in tongues almost always refers to the ability to speak another language not previously learned (or be heard in another language), and is never extolled as the most desirable or preferable spiritual gift. Churches that make "speaking in tongues" the major point of their religious experience, do not have their priorities right. They are majoring in the one spiritual gift that can be most easily counterfeited, thus are leaving themselves vulnerable to deception.
Ron,

I could not agree with you more than if I were a member of your local Church. My paternal side was charasmatic,my grandfather was a Church of God pastor. Grandmother spoke in "tongues". I know about the "test" you are aware of.

Legalistic indeed. Truthfully,blasphemous.

Oh well,it's just another avenue of the devil to confuse those whom The Father has given The Son. As old as Adam and Eve. Nothing new under the sun.
Well if you watch Benny Hinn, he has that German evangelist on from time to time and he shows soccer stadiums in Nigeria jam packed with Christians and millions standing outside the soccer stadium listening in on loud speakers spread throughout the throngs. He claims to have held revivals for 9 million people in his meetings. I saw the video footage and those numbers could be close estimates. But Benny Hinn is a controversial figure so take his evidence with a grain of salt. :roll:

Here is an interesting link on the Nigerian effort:
http://www.rickross.com/reference/hinn/hinn48.html
Dark Lord,

I've seen him and to be blunt,I was extremely revolted. It wouldn't shock me if a lot of goofballs went to hear these types,but 9 million? I doubt it.

To hear a humble purveyor of the Gospel of Christ as preached by say Paul the Apostle???

Maybe 1000 at the high side?

The Bible clearly teaches that God's Heros are not impressive to MEN. And vice versa.
I went to a Benny Hinn revival when he came to Louisville. He's a charlatan of the first degree, but he is entertaining. :lol:
I was not impressed. I saw him on TV a long time ago. Nicest thing for me is to say I was not impressed!
Here is an interesting article about how Christianity, and Penticostal Christianity in particular, is sweeping Nigeria. I did some checking and have learned that according to some sources, Christianity is now the majority religion in that country, when it used to be that of Islam.

If Islam is not losing the numbers that the origional article implies, then how do we account for the sudden and sweeping rise of Christianity within the Dark Continent?

And note, the article states that the ever growing Penticostals are stressing success, getting ahead, and growth of the church. With this recipe, does this mean that perhaps they will begin to forge even further into the north, where Islam has been dominating? I realize that it worries the more traditional and fixed Christian churches, so perhaps the Muslim population is also feeling the pinch as well?
John,

According to your article,it is an open question about the religious demographics of Nigeria. I lament the pentecostal thing because these folks will eventually fall off that emotional wagon and leave the faith for all intents and purposes. Man cannot sustain himself on emotional jags and God's Word is our "ark" so to speak,not emotions.

Of course some will find the proper way to worship God in the Bible and be stronger for it,but this emotionalism worship thing is nothing but a dead end of nothingness.

My guess and it's only a guess is the pentecostalism is gaining converts from already saved believers who worshipped in some more indigenous fashion.

My friend reports that there is increasing desire for strict Bible teaching in some areas,but as always,this will be the few. The positive volition seems to be in Cameroon,parts of southern Nigeria,Burundi,Sierra Leone and Congo(believe it or not).

Positive volition towards Biblical Christian worship,not just believing in Christ is what I mean here.
He also strongly believes we are soon to witness an EXPLOSION of new Christians in India. I hope so.
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