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Socialism Vs Fascism: What Differencies?
#21
Q: The form of your argument could be just as well used to prove cow and wolves are the same. That is: since cows and wolves have 4 feet, they must be the same. One infers that your argument is therefore faulty.
Jefferson: I place economy among the first and important virtues, and public debt as the greatest of dangers. To preserve our independence, we must not let our rulers load us with perpetual debt. We must make our choice between economy and liberty, or profusion and servitude. If we can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of caring for them, they will be happy.
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#22
Found something that's nicely phrased, might refreshen the discussion whether Adolf belongs to us lefties or the right wing.

"German industry collaborated with their Nazi government during the Third Reich, thus exploiting the working class in the interest of productivity and efficiency."

"Hitler's order offered German capitalists, badly hit by the great recession, the prospects of huge profits. German workers did, admittedly, enjoy full employment, but, as William Schirer has said, this was at the cost of being reduced to serfdom and poverty wages."

Now tell me that's not exactly what you're introducing to America, which isn't really left. Wink1 [/quote]
"You know, Paul, Reagan proved that deficits don't matter." Dick Cheney
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#23
quadrat Wrote:Found something that's nicely phrased, might refreshen the discussion whether Adolf belongs to us lefties or the right wing.

"German industry collaborated with their Nazi government during the Third Reich, thus exploiting the working class in the interest of productivity and efficiency."

"Hitler's order offered German capitalists, badly hit by the great recession, the prospects of huge profits. German workers did, admittedly, enjoy full employment, but, as William Schirer has said, this was at the cost of being reduced to serfdom and poverty wages."

Now tell me that's not exactly what you're introducing to America, which isn't really left. Wink1
[/quote]

"Q", I thought we were going to start Linking our references from now on? This is the last warning. From now on, your posts that clearly need links and are not given, WILL BE DELETED.

and yes, there are those who also do not link as they should. But they are not nearly as guilty as you are. And I am attempting to get them to also comply. but you are definately the worst, and are going to feel it first. So get used to it, and don't come whinning here to me when it most assuridly is going to happen.
___________________________________________________________________________________________________
"INSIDE EVERY PROGRESSIVE IS A TOTALITARIAN SCREAMING TO GET OUT" - David Horowitz

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#24
More Wikkipedia stuff - this derived from a book on Volkswagen and Porsche
Frederic F Clairmont Wrote:Hitler’s order offered German capitalists, badly hit by the great recession, the prospects of huge profits. German workers did, admittedly, enjoy full employment, but, as William Schirer has said ("The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich", Simon & Schuster, New York, 1959.), this was at the cost of being reduced to serfdom and poverty wages. It was not long before these conditions became the lot of the whole of occupied Europe. Competition and flexibility of labour were the watchwords in the Third Reich - structural adjustment in all but name. It made the preparations for the warmongering of 1937 possible. But the slogan "Freude durch Arbeit" (joy through work) degenerated into "Vernichtung durch Arbeit" (annihilation through work), because after this adjustment, there was death. At Volkswagen, the foreign workforce subjected to forced labour was exposed to the cold (photos in the book show young Soviet women, reduced to slavery, working barefoot), incessant beatings, malnutrition and early death.
Doesn't sound like the industries went down this dead-end path voluntarily, does it?
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#25
More Wikipedia stuff on fascism:
Quote:The Labour Charter of 1927, promulgated by the Grand Council of Fascism, stated in article 7:

"The corporative State considers private initiative, in the field of production, as the most efficient and useful instrument of the Nation," then goes on to say in article 9 that: "State intervention in economic production may take place only where private initiative is lacking or is insufficient, or when are at stakes the political interest of the State. This intervention may take the form of control, encouragement or direct management."
Well, doesn't that sound a bit like tanker planes and Fannie Mae?

Doesn't sound a lot like communism, anyway. Seems that fascism never intended great influence by the state in the economy. That was 1927. Two years later, Laissez-faire economics collapsed spectacularly. 1933, the nazis, the fascists came to power. Trying to fix the Great Depression, spending half of their reign at quite some war, and the other half preparing for it. Yes, there were some state inventions in the economy, and so they occured in the USA after they joined WW2.

Also liked this part from the wikipedia article
Quote:Fascism is a totalitarian nationalist political ideology and mass movement that is concerned with notions of cultural decline or decadence, and which seeks to achieve a millenarian national rebirth by exalting the nation or race, as well as promoting cults of unity, strength and purity.

Various scholars attribute different characteristics to fascism, but the following elements are usually seen as its integral parts: nationalism, militarism, totalitarianism, dictatorship, populism, collectivism, statism, social interventionism, and economic planning. In addition, fascism opposes communism, liberalism, democratic socialism, and reactionary conservatism (taking into account that fascists made alliances with conservatives more often than other groups and that some fascists associated with conservatism such as self-proclaimed Hungarian fascist Gyula Gömbös). Though nationalist in nature, fascist movements have sought alliances with each other in different countries on common beliefs, such as opposition to communism.
"You know, Paul, Reagan proved that deficits don't matter." Dick Cheney
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#26
I think that Jonah Goldberg and those authors that JohnL has posted here know more about the nature of fascism than those who scribble at Wikipedia. But you have brought up a new facet of Wikipedia that I had not considered before: the intent there is to amuse.

Clearly the word "fascist" is not well defined in the popular mind, since nearly everyone uses the term to denigrate their political opponent.
Jefferson: I place economy among the first and important virtues, and public debt as the greatest of dangers. To preserve our independence, we must not let our rulers load us with perpetual debt. We must make our choice between economy and liberty, or profusion and servitude. If we can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of caring for them, they will be happy.
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