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Korean War Possible?
#21
(11-21-2015, 01:53 PM)Ron Lambert Wrote: North Korea is incredibly weak. Those who are not among the elite in Pyongyang are always hungry and near starving...

This is the main reason why the younger generation in South Korea does not want to have anything to do with North Korea.
They often consider it to be 'another foreign country'.

North Korea means a financial disaster in case of any intervention from outside - maybe one day it will fall apart by itself.
Nobody in South Korea is willing to sacrifice the present life-style in return of unification.

To blame is somewhat China, which keeps its border open to North Korea.
Without China and borders blocked, North Korea in its present political setup would cease even to exist within a few months I guess.

We don't know the future of North Korea here in Japan, just waiting, nothing else what can be done about it.

These people in power in North Korea are unable to provide a good life for their citizens, they prefer to keep all people poor and stupid - there is no economic explanation, why North Korea is poorer off than neighboring Chinese provinces - except failed politics.
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#22
We see the same thing in this country. Economic failure, deterioration and ruin, with loss of jobs and loss of decent housing--in cities like Detroit, that have been run by Democrats for over 50 years. So-called "progressive" policies do not work. This is the true face of socialism/communism.

       
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#23
So is Atlanta, Ron, Atlanta is a success story for the ages. A city where any black person in America can and does excel, unlike any other city on earth.

High end neighborhoods down there with 0 whites in them, manicured lawns and all that stuff.

Things are not as simple as your political ideology thinks it is.

Nashville is also a hard core democrat city and a minature Atlanta and Knoxville is hard core GOP since 1861 and developmentally way behind Nashville, so how could this be?

Detroit sucks due to the reactionary mentality of black inhabitants, not the ideology. They wanted white people out and they got it along with their assets. Atlanta blacks are not like that.
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#24
(11-22-2015, 05:55 AM)yohan Wrote: These people in power in North Korea are unable to provide a good life for their citizens, they prefer to keep all people poor and stupid - there is no economic explanation, why North Korea is poorer off than neighboring Chinese provinces - except failed politics.

Its because they are Pathological(i.e. Paranoid Schizophrenic) Collectivists.
___________________________________________________________________________________________________
All men are frauds. The only difference between them is that some admit it. I myself deny it.
H. L. Mencken
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#25
http://www.koreaherald.com/view.php?ud=20160211001120

For the full story, see link above.

There is no progress between North and South Korea.

I do not understand however all these South Korean companies, which are trying to invest in any co-operation project with North Korea since years.

If I were a South Korean company, I would move on with my production to somewhere else, likely to Philippines, which is not far away by ship.

Quote:Pyongyang on Thursday froze South Korean assets in the inter-Korean industrial complex in its border city of Gaeseong, closed the factory park and declared it as a military off-limit zone in an angry response to Seoul’s decision to pull out of it.

The unpredictable regime ordered South Koreans to leave the complex by 5:30 p.m. on the day and allowed them to bring to the South only “personal belongings,” according to a statement from the North’s Committee for Peaceful Unification of the Fatherland handling cross-border relations.

At about 10 p.m., the South Korean government confirmed that all of the 280 South Korean workers who had been at the facility returned home safely.
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Apparently in line with Pyongyang’s instructions, North Korean workers did not show up at the park, Seoul officials said. Some 55,000 North Korean workers worked at the complex through which Pyongyang raked in around $100 million annually.
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#26
http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2016/02...rywqrR94rg

Full article see link above.

There are also reports in the Japanese news of course, but a little different from the South Korean news.

It is not clear to me which government made the first step, the North is accusing the South, the South is accusing the North, as usual, but S. K. producers are rather surprisingly more angry with the South than with the North.

Quote:North Korea, in a fit of anger over U.S.-South Korean military drills, pulled its workers from Kaesong for about five months in 2013.
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The factory park, which started producing goods in 2004, has provided 616 billion won ($560 million) of cash to North Korea, South Korean Unification Minister Hong Yong-pyo said.

Combining South Korean initiative, capital and technology with the North’s cheap labor, the industrial park has been seen as a test case for reunification between the Koreas. Last year, 124 South Korean companies hired 54,000 North Korean workers to produce socks, wristwatches and other goods worth about $500 million.
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South Korean businesses with factories at the park reacted with a mixture of disappointment and anger. In a statement, the association of South Korean companies at Kaesong denounced Seoul’s decision as “entirely incomprehensible and unjust.”
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#27
Yohan, this is very worrisome to me, having been stationed in ROK in 1971, 2nd Infantry Division. I feel particularly close to the Korean people and spent a lot of time between the Im Jim River and Seoul, which is very close to the border. There is little wiggle room should NK choose to invade. I believe the ROKs would prevail, but the damage done would be totally horrendous.

I was stationed right outside Munsan, along the Imjin River. From there, along Highway 1, to Seoul, it is just like one huge Bowling Alley, where all things lead to Seoul. The sustained destruction would be like nothing before.

Also, UIs(unidentified individuals) are constantly trying to infiltrate into the South, so as to cause trouble. We kill almost all of them, but enough get through, that they would be able to help pave the way for NK's invasion. They would try to blow bridges, kill leaders, set out UIDs, and anything that would slow up the ROKs from responding quickly.

I just hope and pray they are smart enough not to attempt an invasion. And too, it would be a 'last resort' sort of thing for them. North Korea needs to be replaced, because they are the most dangerous entity in the world.
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All men are frauds. The only difference between them is that some admit it. I myself deny it.
H. L. Mencken
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#28
Openly said, we here in Japan have no idea, how this all will continue in the future.

North Korea remains a headache in this region, and luckily for us we are a bit away from them with the Japanese Sea between - not so far, a few 100s of miles, but better than sharing a common border with them like South Korea.

For South Korea the long common border is indeed a serious security issue.

I do not understand this government in North Korea, it could be a rather prosperous little place, with about 25 million people, living comfortably out of transit and tourism, mining and also cheap labor. They have open borders to China and Russia and easy shipping route to Japanese ports, for example to Niigata, which is also used by the Russians.

Even if they don't like to have any contact with South Korea, I do not really understand their hate against Japan, as the Japanese did not participate in the Korean War which was so destructive for Korea. Around 1950 the Japanese Army did not even exist.

Korea was a Japanese colony and not a Japanese war target and after WWII it was given over to the US in not such a bad condition. The situation in Pyongyang or Seoul could not be compared with destroyed cities in China.

Nowadays, most Japanese don't want to have anything to do with the North, considering North and South Korea as 2 countries. Japan can so far easily communicate with South Korea and Taiwan, and even - except political propaganda - with China. - But with North Korea so far 'almost nothing'.

Most Japanese politicians are rather disappointed with North Korea and decided to do 'almost nothing', just waiting...

There is no other solution so far, at least not for Japan.
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#29
(02-11-2016, 12:51 PM)yohan Wrote: I do not understand this government in North Korea, it could be a rather prosperous little place, with about 25 million people, living comfortably out of transit and tourism, mining and also cheap labor. They have open borders to China and Russia and easy shipping route to Japanese ports, for example to Niigata, which is also used by the Russians.

Very few do understand their warped outlook. But one thing is for certain. They are under the curse of Collectivism at its most extreme. Collectivism, no matter which brand, never works in the end, and eventually they will almost certainly go out with a Big Band.

Quote:Even if they don't like to have any contact with South Korea, I do not really understand their hate against Japan, as the Japanese did not participate in the Korean War which was so destructive for Korea. Around 1950 the Japanese Army did not even exist.

One of the almost guaranteed maxims in Collectivist ideology, whether it be Marxism, National Socialism, or Fascism, is the need for at least one Scapegoat. This is absolutely necessary, so it can be blamed for all the troubles they created for themselves. NK is using their old anger for the way they were treated under Japanese rule, prior to WWII, and using it for their blame machine. ROKs have already gotten past this, and moved on.

Quote:Nowadays, most Japanese don't want to have anything to do with the North, considering North and South Korea as 2 countries. Japan can so far easily communicate with South Korea and Taiwan, and even - except political propaganda - with China. - But with North Korea so far 'almost nothing'.

Most Japanese politicians are rather disappointed with North Korea and decided to do 'almost nothing', just waiting...

There is no other solution so far, at least not for Japan.

Its the "Going out with a Big Bang" thing that everyone has to worry about. When it all collapses around themselves, they will have to take it out on someone, and Japan, along with the ROKs, are to blame for every ill they have had to endure. Its always someone else's fault. Spiteful
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All men are frauds. The only difference between them is that some admit it. I myself deny it.
H. L. Mencken
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#30
North Korea just executed another of its top leaders, it's only a matter of time before they beat Kim Jong Un to it and take him out.
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#31
http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2016/02...r2XNfl97cs

I have mixed feelings about what South Korea did, but maybe it is better to finish this co-operation.

Maybe S.K. companies should be assisted by the S.K. government for a new start with a better, more reliable partner offering cheap labor, like in Philippines, Vietnam, Bangladesh...

S K. companies paid the salaries for all these 55.000 N. K. workers, but the workers received only about 20 percent, the other 80 percent was taken away by the N. K. government for other, unclear purposes.

Quote:PAJU, SOUTH KOREA – South Korea has cut off power and water supplies to a factory park in North Korea, officials said Friday, a day after the North deported all South Korean workers there and ordered a military takeover of the complex that had been the last major symbol of cooperation between the rivals.

It is the latest in an escalating standoff over North Korea’s recent rocket launch that Seoul, Washington and their allies view as a banned test of missile technology. The North says its actions on the Kaesong complex were a response to Seoul’s earlier decision to suspend operations as punishment for the launch.

On Thursday night, the 280 South Korean workers who had been at the park crossed the border into South Korea, several hours after a deadline set by the North passed. Their departure quashed concerns that some might be held hostage, and lowered the chances that the standoff might lead to violence or miscalculations.

But they weren’t allowed to bring back any finished products and equipment at their factories because the North announced it will freeze all South Korean assets there.

The North also said it was closing an inter-Korean highway linking to Kaesong and shutting down two cross-border communication hotlines.

“I was told not to bring anything but personal goods, so I’ve got nothing but my clothes to take back,” a manager at a South Korean apparel company at the complex, who declined to give his name, told The Associated Press by phone before he crossed to the South.

Chang Beom Kang, who has been running an apparel company in Kaesong since 2009, said from South Korea that his company has about 920 North Korean workers — who didn’t show up Thursday — and seven South Korean managers at Kaesong.

He said one of his workers, who entered Kaesong earlier Thursday, was about to cross the border to return to South Korea with thousands of women’s clothes produced at the factory. But at the last minute the employee had to drive back to the factory to unload the clothes because of North Korea’s announcement that it would freeze all South Korean assets there.

“I’m devastated now,” Kang said by phone, saying he’s worried about losing credibility with clients because of the crisis.

Seoul’s Unification Ministry said in a statement Friday that it had stopped power transmissions to the factory park. Ministry officials said the suspension subsequently led to a halt of water supplies to Kaesong.

The current standoff flared after North Korea carried out a nuclear test last month, followed by the long-range rocket launch on Sunday that came after Seoul had warned of serious consequences.

In one of its harshest possible punishment options, South Korea on Thursday began work to suspend operations at the factory park. Seoul said its decision on Kaesong was an effort to stop North Korea from using hard currency earned from the park to pay for its nuclear and missile programs.

The North’s reaction was swift.

The country’s Committee for the Peaceful Reunification of Korea said in a statement later Thursday that the South’s shutdown of Kaesong was a “dangerous declaration of war” and a “declaration of an end to the last lifeline of the North-South relations.”

Such over-the-top rhetoric is typical of the North’s propaganda, but the country appeared to be backing up its language with its strong response.

The statement included crude insults against South Korean President Park Geun-hye, saying she masterminded the shutdown and calling her a “confrontational wicked woman” who lives upon “the groin of her American boss.” Such sexist language is also typical of North Korean propaganda.

North Korea has previously cut off cross-border communication channels in times of tension with South Korea, but they were later restored after animosities eased.

North Korea, in a fit of anger over U.S.-South Korean military drills, pulled its workers from Kaesong for about five months in 2013. But, generally, the complex has long been seen as above the constant squabbling and occasional bloodshed between the rival Koreas, one of the last few bright spots in a relationship more often marked by threats of war.

Park, the South Korean president, has now done something her conservative predecessor resisted, even after two attacks blamed on North Korea killed 50 South Koreans in 2010. She has shown a willingness to take quick action when provoked by the North. When North Korea conducted its fourth nuclear test last month, for instance, she resumed anti-Pyongyang propaganda from loudspeakers along the border, despite what Seoul says was an exchange of cross-border artillery fire the last time she used the speakers.

A group of people braved the rain for hours on the southern side of a cross-border bridge on Thursday anxiously waiting for their family members and co-workers to return to South Korea.

“I don’t think I want my husband to ever work in Kaesong again,” commented a woman who declined to give her name but said her husband was a manager at Taesung, a maker of cosmetics products.

“Whenever the North does something provocative, we worry about our loved ones,” she said.

The factory park, which started producing goods in 2004, has provided 616 billion won ($560 million) in cash to North Korea, South Korean Unification Minister Hong Yong-pyo said.

Combining South Korean initiative, capital and technology with the North’s cheap labor, the industrial park has been seen as a test case for reunification between the Koreas. Last year, 124 South Korean companies hired 54,000 North Korean workers to produce socks, wristwatches and other goods worth about $500 million.
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#32
http://mashable.com/2016/04/04/north-kor...hjZFTD_qqM

Quite interesting to read what some North Koreans who made it up to South Korea are now thinking about their former and present life-style.

North Koreans are not really welcome in South Korea - and I heard the same about them in Japan. These people are already too much brainwashed, despite their escape, they cannot accept a new life under totally different conditions.

You might expect, they are truly refugees, grateful and really want to work and 'disappear' within their new neighborhood, togetherwith people who are from the other side but of the same ethnic group, speaking the same language. Or at least they want to disappear within the Korean large community in Japan, where they can hardly be recognized as Korean from the North. -

But - it's disappointing, this is not the case. Their behavior is somewhat similar to these Muslim refugees in Europe, they demand the new state should care about them, about all and everything, give me house, give me money, give me food and medical care etc. - However wherever they find some work they start to complain about low payment, are suddenly in violent quarrels with other co-workers, some of them even arrested for crimes...

The question is somewhat open, how is life now in North Korea, and not only in Pyongyang? With an open border to China, most pictures do not show such a bad situation - despite this place is somehow nevertheless 'isolated'.

Comparing life in Pyongyang or in the other cities like Hamhung, under Kim the first, Kim the second, and now under Kim Jong Un, the No. 3 - life seems to be much better now than before. This is NO joke... various visits of TV teams from Russia and China and some private visitors confirm that... with excellent video quality, this cannot be all a setup.

Well, North Korea remains a strange and restricted place and we have no idea who is now really in control of this little country.
What is this unpredictable government doing just now?

Sometimes I think, the Western world pays too much attention to this reclusive corner near to Japan.
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#33
Perhaps thats the reason why they are constantly beating their chests and acting the way they do.   They are like a troupe of monkeys suddenly aware of a major predator below them.  The uproar and outrage is deafening,.......and they know that the major predator cannot get to them up in the trees.  S13
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All men are frauds. The only difference between them is that some admit it. I myself deny it.
H. L. Mencken
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